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To: who_would_fardels_bear
Calvinists seem to claim that we fools don't get it because we don't understand how a loving God could predestine us to Hell. Maybe it is the Calvinists that don't understand how an all-knowing God could create a universe with enough wiggle room to allow us free will.

Since you think that we deny free will, perhaps you would mind doing 2 simple things:

1. Define Biblical Predestination &
2. define free will.

Perhaps, you just don't understand what we believe and so you do 3000 word essays just to show us that you really don't.

112 posted on 02/19/2002 5:16:23 PM PST by CCWoody
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To: CCWoody
I have been in many of the Calvinist/Predestination/Free Will threads on FreeRepublic, so I have a good idea of what Calvinists refer to as "free will" and what a commonsensical human being believes the definition to be.

Yes, Calvinists claim to believe in a very pallid form of free will, but when pressed, some will say that free will really isn't all that important to them, and so they don't care if their version of it is worth much support.

I even remember reading a tract from Spurgeon on one of the threads where he declares "free will" an oxymoron and Spurgeon seems to be the supreme Calvinist saint.

Basically, I'm note even an Arminian. I believe that if God knows all things from the beginning of time, or if God is completely outside time and knows everything, that life would be pretty boring for Him.

No matter how vast the universe is, it is finite as far as we can tell. To say that an infinite God would be satisfied with watching over a finite universe with a finite life span seems rather contradictory.

I suppose that he could have countless other universes that He is watching over as well, some much more complex than ours, but that would seem to contradict all of the quotes suggesting that Christ died once for all (or is that passage supposed to be interpreted as only those in this universe?)

Anyway, I believe that if there is a God and the Bible is complete and accurate, and the universe is a creation of God, that philosophical inquiry and Biblical study will always lead to the same conclusion.

There has been a sufficient amount of Bible-quoting in these threads. It would be a much better use of peoples' time, I believe, if we started attacking this problem from the philosophical side to see if it leads in the same direction as the Biblical studies.

Just a thought ... expressed in significantly less than 3000 words.

P.P.S.: Sorry if my lengthy responses do not appeal to your chatroom sensibilities.

351 posted on 02/20/2002 8:51:20 PM PST by who_would_fardels_bear
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