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To: Francohio
I would merely point out that back in the 1800's, the conventional wisdom in America stated that the swarthy, non-Anglo Saxon South Eastern Europeans and Catholics were going to be the death of us.

We seem to have done alright, integrating those non-WASPs into our society, and Bosnia most recently was an ok place to be until circa 1990 when the wolves took over leadership positions in the various flocks, indicating that the moderate Balkans brand of Islam wasn't quite the imminent danger it's been portrayed as.

I don't quite agree with your Bulgarian/Russian take on things either: they're basically broke, and aren't able to offer anybody anything - hell, the Russians are losing their own back yard, Central Asia, to America, never mind the Balkans.

94 posted on 02/15/2002 10:03:26 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: Hoplite
I would merely point out that back in the 1800's, the conventional wisdom in America stated that the swarthy, non-Anglo Saxon South Eastern Europeans and Catholics were going to be the death of us.

Well, Hoplite, I would merely point out that these splendidly swarthy non-WASP chaps to whom you refer, did not arrive armed, never forcibly disposessed the 'native' stock in any of the many areas in which they became a majority, and were linked, albeit tenuously, by a religion similar to that practiced by the inhabitants. Furthermore, they shared certain crucial social customs with the natives, such as monogamy and the wearing of trousers in the home. Furthermore, they came to integrate (or survive), not take over.

Now as to the Bosnian brand of Islam: why the contrary Serbs of Bosnia, for that is what they are, became Muslims at the time of the Bogomil Heresy is just as much a mystery to me as it is to them. Suffice it to say, it got them a very good deal with the Turks at the expense of their fellow Serbs, upon whom they inflicted untold miseries for many centuries. I know personally that they are not very good Muslims, having hoisted many a jar of the local with a few of them. However, when the chips were down they lost no time in opening their province to Islamic Jihad Terrorists of every known stripe. Furthermore, although I personally know that many of them might wish to be rid of these more fanatical Muslims (and Albanians) ASAP, they have not yet done so. They won't until they drive the remaining Bosnian Serbs (Christians, you see) out of Bosnia. Their biggest worry is that a flood of unfashionable Albanians will try to pounce on the rich lands soon to be Serb-free.

This, and the fact that the Bosnians are guilty of the same blood-curdling atrocities as the Serbs and Croats (another story there) means that we shouldn't be so anxious to help them, except perhaps with 'humanitarian' aid. Even there, the Saudis have been magnificent in pouring out treasure to them, so they really don't need our money.

I think, Hoplite, that using our American standards, you have accurately perceived much injustice meted out by the Serbs, and like many another well-meaning American, you have assumed the other side to be 'victims' worthy of every assistance. In order to help you bolster these feelings, the Albanians and Bosnians have retained the PR firm of Ruder and Finn, one of the best known on the planet. Your opinions may have therefore, for the very best of humanitarian reasons, been molded to fit you. Ruder and Finn, among others, at a cost of many millions per year, have been shown to have completely fabricated many of the horror stories you read, while of course brilliantly suppressing any stories harmful to their clients. Hoplite, don't be shocked. It's their job to "Wag the Dog" and they do it very well.

The recent truth would have been bad enough to damn the Serbs, the Croats, the Slovenians, the Bosnians, and of course the friendly and colorful Albanians, forever. But Ruder and Finn marketed a bad guy, and turned you into an interventionist in the Balkans, where I am afraid we have made a terrible situation worse.

Speaking of perceptions, the Russians and their brothers, the South Slavs have long perceived themselves to be the Christian world's bulwark against the hordes of Islam. This perception, like most, is not completely inaccurate! As to the Russians and Bulgarians being too poor to sort this out, HA! I assure you there are enough unemployed volunteers in Russia to form an army of mercenaries, with the traditional Russian government blessing, who look forward to "living off the land," and sorting out the KLA and any other Albanians they might catch, because they are allied with the Chechnyans (and because it is something to do). If the Albanians aren't careful, they may help fulfill the old Czarist dream of an ice-free Mediterranean port!

101 posted on 02/16/2002 7:51:21 AM PST by Francohio
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