KelTec makes a spring metal clip that attaches to the slide. Makes it easy to 'clip' onto your waistband, back pocket, top of boot, etc.
Posted on 02/06/2002 11:44:28 AM PST by inflorida
This just reported on Fox news. A 10 year old child in Pennsylvania was accidentally shot in the head during a school demonstration by an off-duty cop.
The child is expected to survive.
Well, the nuclear explosion bit is probably hyperbole (certainly never tested!), but I would not be surprised if a Glock was drop-safe even from a 1000-foot fall. Such a fall would probably damage the gun beyond repair, but the momentum of the striker would still be pretty well diverted away from the primer.
Probably true of Glocks (unless one uses something else to pull the trigger); not true of all other makes. Many firearms, especially target weapons, are NOT drop-safe when the safety is on "fire".
Not quite true. Nearly all injury-causing unintended discharges result from negligence (the injuries, if not the discharges), but unintended discharges may occur (especicially on a range) without negligence.
For example, sometimes after firing a round from a semi-auto with a light trigger pull, I will accidentally fire a follow-on shot. I'm sure I'm not the only person who's done this. The second shot was not deliberately fired, but I wouldn't class it as "negligent" either; after all, the safety rules were followed, the gun was pointed safely down range, and I was prepared for the possibility of a follow-on discharge even though I didn't want one.
There are also a few cases where people have been injured or killed due to freak malfunctions which could not really be attributed to negligence; the number of such cases in any year, however, could probably be counted on one hand even if one was lacking a few fingers.
Am I the only one who finds this particular statement funny?
The DA/SA seems like a great concept in theory, but the Glock's action is superior. The first shot on a Glock is essentially double-action (most, but not all, of the energy in the striker comes from the trigger) but follow-on shots will be single action as long as the trigger is not fully released. If the trigger is released fully the next shot will be double-action just like the first one.
Beyond the advantage of having a consistent trigger pull on all shots, the Glock also has the advantage that releasing the trigger will decock the firearm. With an SA/DA pistol, the shooter must remember to decock the weapon before reholstering; with a Glock, the only requirement is to remove one's finger from the trigger.
With which part of my post did you disagree? That people unintentionally fire Glocks by putting their finger on the trigger when they shouldn't, implying that Glocks sometimes end up in the hands of not-terribly-brilliant people? That many firearms with manual safeties have trigger pulls that would be dangerously light without the safety? That both modes of 'user failure' have occurred on firearms with manual safeties?
While I sometimes make stupid mistakes in my posts, I reread my earlier post and see nothing wrong in it.
As the Commandant said "Guns do not go off by accident.".
I see the same thing in INS. We have one officer who unloads his weapon, before going home, because he said he was affraied he might accidentally shoot his wife, while unloading it at home.
Our Supervisor told him to start looking for a new job or else make sure his weapon is loaded while on duty or in uniform.
I've seen many other examples of Federal LEO's that have no clue about weapon safety.
Both "accidental discharge" and "negligent discharge" are somewhat judgemental terms; while that may be appropriate in some cases, the term "unintended discharge" would seem a good term to encompass both "accidental" and "negligent" discharges.
If proper safety rules are followed, an unintended discharge, even if one occurs, is unlikely to cause anyone any harm. While firearms do not malfunction often, malfunctions can and do sometimes occur. An unintended discharge in such case may not constitute negligence if care was taken beforehand to ensure that the bullet would be fired in a safe direction.
They are there for SA conditions. They have also been improved over the decades to also help prevent ND caused by accidental trigger pulls. The Beretta disconnects the trigger, such that pulling on the trigger has no effect at all. Even S&W has added an additional feature that prevents firing if the mag is released. Which leads me to your next “Glock Rules” fallacy.
”In a carry piece, however, a manual safety just adds one more thing to go "wrong"--if it's set on "fire" by mistake, the odds of an unintended discharge are much higher than with a Glock, and if it's left on "safe" by mistake when the gun is needed, the owner may fail to stop an attacker from killing him.”
More cops have had their lives saved by manual safeties. When a bad guy gets hold of a cops gun that is a Glock, he only has to pull the trigger and kill the cop. Manual safeties give the cops a few moments to regain control of the situation. It isn’t just the owner that a manual safety is trying to prevent from discharging the gun accidentally. As Col Copper said, “Putting the safety on the trigger is like putting the combination on the outside of the safe.”
The “safety” on the trigger of a Glock is only a drop-fire prevention mechanism. It provides to more safety than a revolver. Which bring me to the next point.
Glocks are not the only drop-safe firearms. Most modern firearms are drop-safe, and Kali is proving that point through the requirement to have drop-safe tests before allowing the firearm to be sold in Kali. It seems most firearms are passing the test. Even revolvers have firing pin disconnects. If the trigger isn’t pressed then the hammer plate is not in place and the hammer will not strike the firing pin. Beretta’s have three safeties including trigger based firing pin blocks. Glocks are no safer than a revolver.
Safeties are not “keeps ‘em from firing at all costs”. They are “safeties”. They are to help prevent mishandling which creates accidental trigger pulls. Glocks are DOA firearms, and a heavy trigger pull does not prevent accidental working of the trigger.
Those super cool gun classes teaching QDM (Quick Draw McGraw) has done more harm to firearm safety than anything a stupid person has ever accomplished. Speed draws have caused more cops to loose their toes. If a person can learn to “keep their finger off the safety [read: trigger]”, then they also can learn to release a manual safety, millions of people have. Professional gun competitions require safeties on, and I bet you couldn’t beat the pro’s at QDM.
It seems Glock has you brainwashed, nicely.
Any suggestions?
If I had just arrived from another planet it would be easy to see from the posts made by the people pinged above that intelligence is on the side of Gaston Glock's creation and the balance are uninformed or in some cases just plain stupid. Kinda like the knee jerk liberals that we all hate.
Eaker
For some intelligent conversation about Glocks try the link below.
Eaker
KelTec makes a spring metal clip that attaches to the slide. Makes it easy to 'clip' onto your waistband, back pocket, top of boot, etc.
Lady, you do not sound like somebody I want to have an argument with!
My beef with the Glock is that in the hands of somebody who does not follow the safety rules and is an inexperienced or careless gun handler, there is one fewer step between them and negligent discharge. Fact of the matter is that there are people out there who hold guns with their fingers on the trigger when they do not actually intend to kill whoever or whatever the gun is pointed at. Chalk it up to our TV culture or whatever, but it happens. And a lot of these people are LEO's.
That said, an argument could be made that a manual safety only promotes unsafe gun handling by providing the user with a false sense of security. With well trained and concientious users, I would agree 100%. I will assume you are in this catagory (see, I'm being nice).
Also, there are reports with this story that the gun fired when it was accidentally dropped. I don't really believe this, but if that is true, then I think that it is very unlikely that the gun involved was a Glock. The Glock has a reputation for an extremely low rate of accidental firings due to dropping or mechanical failure.
So in a perfect world where we are all well trained and serious about gun ownership, Glocks would be great for everyone. But as long as they are handled by people who are not so well trained and serious (including some LEO's) there will be a higher rate of negligent discharges.
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