Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Don't Weaken Arafat, Saudi Warns Bush
The New York Times ^ | 01/27/2002 | ELAINE SCIOLINO

Posted on 01/26/2002 5:24:48 PM PST by Pokey78

RIYADH, Saudi Arabia, Jan. 26 — In a blunt criticism of President Bush, Saudi Arabia's senior intelligence official today called Yasir Arafat, the Palestinian leader, "a man of peace" and warned that any action by the United States to weaken him would destroy prospects for a peace settlement and have serious repercussions for the kingdom.

In a wide-ranging interview, Prince Nawwaf bin Abdul Aziz, the kingdom's director of the intelligence service, also acknowledged that after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, the vast majority of Saudi young adults felt considerable sympathy for the cause of the Saudi-born terrorist Osama bin Laden, even though they rejected the attacks in New York and Washington.

A classified American intelligence report taken from a Saudi intelligence survey in mid-October of educated Saudis between the ages of 25 and 41 concluded that 95 percent of them supported Mr. bin Laden's cause, according to a senior administration official with access to intelligence reports.

Prince Nawwaf confirmed the existence of the survey but did not specify the level of support. He attributed the support to what he called feelings of the people against the United States, largely, he said, because of its unflinching support of Israel against the Palestinians.

Although he insisted that Saudi Arabia had no intention of asking the United States to withdraw its military presence from the kingdom, which Mr. bin Laden has long demanded, the prince said Saudi Arabia would not support an American military campaign against Iraq or any other Arab or Muslim country.

Mr. Bush suggested on Friday that Mr. Arafat was "enhancing terrorism" in the case of a boatload of arms smuggled for use against Israel, but Prince Nawwaf challenged that criticism and warned Mr. Bush not to punish or isolate him.

"All the governments, the people of the region believe that America is supporting Israel whether it is right or wrong, and now if something happens to Yasir Arafat, the feeling against American policy will be stronger," he said. "Anybody will be able to use it to damage American interests in the area. You will put Saudi Arabia in a very bad position, because feelings about the Middle East problem are very strong."

The prince, who is in his 70's, is a half brother of both the ailing King Fahd and of Crown Prince Abdullah, the de facto ruler. He spoke in English during the 45-minute interview that began in his headquarters and continued in a car en route to a reception at the residence of the crown prince.

At the reception, held in honor of visiting scholars and intellectuals attending an annual Saudi folk festival, Crown Prince Abdullah was less pointed in his criticism of American foreign policy. Asked by an American journalist what message he would send to Mr. Bush about the war on terrorism, he replied: "My advice to President Bush is to pursue the interests of the United States. This will solve everything."

The crown prince has repeatedly called on the administration to become more engaged in resolving the Palestinian crisis and has harshly criticized Washington for what he sees as its refusal to put pressure on Israel.

For his part, Prince Nawwaf said that if Mr. Arafat left the scene, no other Palestinian would come forward to make peace. "If the United States is going to make it worse by cutting ties with Arafat, who will come to make a peace settlement?" he asked. "Do you think anybody will do so? Or do you want to destroy the process to reach a peace settlement?

"I'm telling the Americans: You can accuse Arafat of anything except that he is not a man of peace."

Prince Nawwaf is among the most trusted advisers of the crown prince. He replaced Prince Turki bin Faisal, who was chief of intelligence for more than 25 years but was suddenly removed from his post last summer.

The interview underscored the widening gap in the perceptions and expectations of each other of Saudi Arabia and the United States following Sept. 11.

On the American side, there is an official line that relations are strong and that the Saudis are cooperating with the criminal investigation and the effort to freeze the assets of Saudi entities that may be supporting terrorism. But there is deep unease, especially among the uniformed military, that the Saudis are constraining the American mission in the Persian Gulf and that American commanders are discussing a possible shrinkage of the military presence in Saudi Arabia.

On the Saudi side, Saudis said in interviews that they expected support from the United States and instead felt that they had been isolated and branded as terrorists.

Saudi Arabia could be the next target of a terror attack, Saudi military officials have told their American counterparts, if both nations appear to be too closely aligned militarily and if the crisis between Israel and Palestinians worsens.

Unwavering support for the Palestinians, despite recent Palestinian attacks against Israeli civilians, is voiced by all levels of society, from government officials and university professors to shopkeepers and teenagers.

Prince Nawwaf said his office had conducted the survey about terrorism "to know about the feeling towards bin Laden, and we can't ignore that there is this feeling."

The survey interviewed educated Saudi men and included industrialists, engineers, doctors and architects, the American official said. Although the official added that it had not been done scientifically, the level of support has surprised both American and Saudi officials.

Prince Nawwaf said sympathy with Mr. bin Laden's cause among Saudis would be lower if a survey were conducted now, after the successful American campaign against the Taliban in Afghanistan, where Mr. bin Laden's network, Al Qaeda, was based. "The feeling would be less because since the war the people know the strong feeling of the people of Afghanistan against the Taliban," he said.

Prince Nawwaf did not respond directly to questions about whether there were Qaeda terrorist cells inside the kingdom. But he reiterated Saudi Arabia's opposition to any military expansion of the American terrorist campaign to other countries.

He said an American military operation to overthrow President Saddam Hussein of Iraq "is not going to damage Saddam Hussein," adding: "It will only give Saddam more credit. Perhaps someone is telling you you will finish off Saddam. No, Saddam will be waiting for you."

Even Mr. Hussein's overthrow would not increase regional stability, he said. "If you succeed, you will divide Iraq into three parts," he said. Iraq would be splintered into a Shiite Muslim-run government in the south, a Kurdish-run government in the north and a Sunni-Muslim run government in the center, he said, adding, "I don't think America will support that."

He made no criticism of the American military presence here, but said: "Who said this about ending the military presence? You never heard this from Saudi Arabia."

But he warned the United States not to abuse the friendship or Saudi hospitality that allows the United States to have a military presence but not a permanent base here.

"Some days you say you want to attack Iraq, some days Somalia, some days Lebanon, some days Syria," he said. "Who do you want to attack? All the Arab world? And you want us to support that? It's impossible. It's impossible."


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: israel
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-52 next last
To: Pokey78
On the Saudi side, Saudis said in interviews that they expected support from the United States and instead felt that they had been isolated and branded as terrorists.

The truth hurts doesn't it. Saudi Arabia is terrorism.

21 posted on 01/26/2002 6:40:12 PM PST by gcraig
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Pissed Off Janitor
Good point. Wacko remarks come in all flavors.
22 posted on 01/26/2002 6:41:12 PM PST by Dog Gone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
Asked by an American journalist what message he would send to Mr. Bush about the war on terrorism, he replied: "My advice to President Bush is to pursue the interests of the United States. This will solve everything."

This is clearly a threat. He obviously thinks he has us by the b*lls becuase of the oil. I suspect President Bush may be holding a few extra cards in this game.

The one thing the "prince" may not have calculated is the fact the we now have a President in office who understands the stakes and has a much larger goal in mind than just the Middle East, the longterm security of United States of America. It might come as shock to the dictators in that region that we are now truly going to be looking out for our own interests. They may find that they no longer qualify for that distinction.

It's funny they present the survey of the "educated males" as some sort or reason why we shouldn't back away from Arafat. I suggest that the survey and statements from the "intellegence" guy only stregthen the belief that they are not on our side and wont be in the future.

One thing about President Bush we've all witnessed and been told is, he demands loyalty, honesty, and actions above words. He's about results, it's clear that our Middle East policies have failed and require a massive rethinking. This is the time to to do just that.

Without the oil hanging over our heads, what does this region have? Nothing, without our thirst for oil, Saudia Arbia would be another Afghanistan. Isreal can take care of herself, if we would only get out the way.

When the fallout settles from the pending conflicts and the historians look back on President Bush's 8 years in office, they will write that this President solved the Middle East problem, like President Reagan before him with the Cold War, with steadfast determination, decisive action, and uncomprimisnig beliefs.

23 posted on 01/26/2002 6:50:10 PM PST by tonyinv
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Dog Gone
There are a couple of really interesting statements in this interview that say completely different things. I'm having trouble figuring out why they are so insistant on saving Arafat though. I know they got the evidence on the Karin A and they know he was behind the arms shipment.

The little tidbit about retaking the survey after the people of Afghanistan were liberated is quite interesting too.

Sounds to me like the royal family is really conflicted right now.

24 posted on 01/26/2002 6:52:39 PM PST by McGavin999
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
Don't Weaken Arafat, Saudi Warns Bush

Which Saudi? The one with our airbase on it? The one that we can blow to smithereens at the drop of a daisy? THAT Saudi?

25 posted on 01/26/2002 6:53:22 PM PST by FrostFire
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: McGavin999
Sounds to me like the royal family is really conflicted right now.

That's how I read it, too.

The royal family is caught between doing the right thing, and their own population which has been thoroughly indoctrinated against the west and Israel. It's really their own cowardice that has allowed things to progress to the state they are now in, but there's no easy fix.

They can't crack down on their own clerics without provoking a revolution, yet if they give into them, they're doomed, too. They are walking a tightrope, and we can only help them to some extent.

26 posted on 01/26/2002 6:59:37 PM PST by Dog Gone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
To perdition with them and AraPIGfat.
27 posted on 01/26/2002 7:03:31 PM PST by LibKill
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
The sooner we have all out war with the mohammedans, the better.
28 posted on 01/26/2002 7:03:36 PM PST by LibWhacker
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
"a man of peace"

It would seem he forgot about Lebanon and Jordan.
29 posted on 01/26/2002 7:08:10 PM PST by BJClinton
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
I don't think Bush would possibly consider mounting a direct attack against the Saudis even though they are probably at the very heart of the terrorist problem. But he could easily WITHDRAW SUPPORT, watch the Saudi royal family get thrown out on their asses or assassinated, and then send in troops to stabilize a dangerous situation.

It's crystal clear that the Saudis have no intention of cooperating with us in the war against terror, not even to the extent of sharing financial records or intelligence data.

As I have said before, the only practical solution to the Saudi problem in the long run is to break the country in two, and separate the holy places from the oil. It's simply too dangerous to have the same arrogant, corrupt people in control of the world economy AND the sacred pilgrim sites of a billion Muslims.

30 posted on 01/26/2002 7:14:00 PM PST by Cicero
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: McGavin999
Yes, there's major upheaval going on over there right now.

According to articles I've been reading, they've approx. 30% unemployment over there, massive corruption, and have a *lot* of "spoiled kid" mentality over there. The Saudi Royal Family used to pay each Saudi Citizen a ~$28,000 stipend (actually hush money) annually. That has now dropped to less than $8,000 and should plummet like a stone because of lack of U.S. demand and low prices.

The Saudi Royal family is now having *major* problems because of the puritanical Islamicism that they promoted is now coming back to "Bite the hand that feeds them." Instead of confronting the issue, the Saudi Royal family just sent the troublemakers elsewhere, meaning to the West, messing our "nest" instead of theirs. Now that the troublemakers have come home and are very powerful, the Saudis are doing whatever possible to keep in power and keep their heads attached. Expect them to sign deals with Russia and China *very* soon and turn very anti-American. I truly expect another Arab oil embargo against the U.S. soon. Count on it.

Food for thought - take a look at this article. The Imam (Chief Cleric) in question is in charge of one of the largest (if not *the* largest) mosque in all of Islam - one that will seat 1/2 Million Muslims *at one time*. Considering that the Muslim pilgrimage, the "Haj", is coming up shortly, and is expecting up to 2 Million pilgrims to attend, this Imam's preaching anti-Americanism is VERY forboding and a sign of things to come.

http://www.arabnews.com/Article.asp?ID=12326

Saturday, January 26, 2002

Islam can’t be diluted: Shuraim

By Abdul Aziz Ghazzawi, Arab News Staff

MAKKAH, 26 January — The Imam of the Grand Mosque in Makkah yesterday warned Muslims that giving in to outside pressure to alter established Islamic principles amounted to treason.

Gemflint's comments: "Makkah" is the city of Mecca, the "Holy City" of Islam. Their website: http://www.saudiarabia.net/text/city/makkahf.htm and http://www.iad.org/Madinah.html

"Bargaining on Islam and on its unquestionable principles amounts to high treason and extreme madness," Sheikh Saud Al-Shuraim said while giving his Friday sermon.

*********"The enemies of the Islamic Ummah will accept nothing less than that the Ummah abandons Islam, distances itself from the Shariah and makes concessions so that it remains a reality only in name," he told the faithful, including, a large number of pilgrims, who were thronging the large mosque complex for the Juma prayer.

In the wake of the Sept. 11 terror attacks, the Western media has claimed that Islam promotes extremism and breeds terrorists of the kind who struck in New York and Washington, killing thousands. There have also been Western calls on governments of Islamic countries to take specific measures, such as amending their school curriculum and disbanding extremist organizations.

But Shuraim said it was unfair to blame Islam for problems it had not created. "Islamic countries and the teachings and principles of Islam have been the target of a smear campaign launched from within and outside the Islamic world," Shuraim added.

He warned against making any "ideological, intellectual or educational" concessions to those who seek to impose submission on Muslims.

Saudi Arabia has come under harsh criticism only because it is ruled by Islam, the imam added.

31 posted on 01/26/2002 7:35:41 PM PST by Gemflint
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: gcraig
"Saudi Arabia is terrorism.

The way I see it, Saudi Arabia is the heartland of terrorism, Afghanistan was the Disneyland of Terrorism.

A Disneyland where young muslim males could live out their jihadist fantasies, remotely related to running off to join the French Foreign Legion, but without, for example, the mass slaughter of co-religionists and forcible "marriage(s)" to local 13 year old girls.

32 posted on 01/26/2002 7:39:34 PM PST by Shermy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: McGavin999
I'm having trouble figuring out why they are so insistant on saving Arafat

There's a lot of Saudi land near Israel, the West Bank, and Lebanon. Maybe they don't want a lot of evicted Palis as new neighbors? They already threw them out once as ungrateful guest-workers during the dust-up with Iraq in 1991.

33 posted on 01/26/2002 7:41:36 PM PST by Pearls Before Swine
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Gemflint; veronica
Plus the Sheikhs have incurred a big debt. I understand that oil must remain above $21 a barrel for Saudi to make a profit, for Russia it's only about $15. Therefore, if they grab market share, big trouble for the Saudis:

Huge Saudi Debt Expected To Increase Further (Veronica's 1/7 thread

"Saudi Arabia's huge debt is expected to increase over the next year. Gulf analysts said stagnating oil prices will make the kingdom one of the biggest debtor nations in the world. Riyad is expected to owe more than $200 billion by the end of 2002.

Already, the analysts said, Saudi Arabia owes $203 billion. The kingdom is expected to borrow another $12 billion during 2002. A study by Saudi economist Ihsan Bu Hlaika said the kingdom turned into a debtor from the oil prices that first stabilized and then dropped during the 1980s. Hlaika said the kingdom has repaid only a small part of its domestic debt.

The study said Riyad is expected to record a $6.6 billion budget deficit for 2001. Saudi officials have maintained that the kingdom will not record a deficit for last year."

34 posted on 01/26/2002 7:45:51 PM PST by Shermy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Dog Gone
As I see it the Saudis brought this on themselves. They put up the money for Osama's terrorist camps. They indoctrinate their young in the fundamentalist whahabi Islam. They could have taken a different approach to the west after the gulf war, but no. I don't know that it is in our interest to try and patch things up with them. Let the chips fall.
35 posted on 01/26/2002 7:50:05 PM PST by the rifleman
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: weikel
I think its time for the western powers to colonize saudi.
36 posted on 01/26/2002 7:58:05 PM PST by stumpy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Shermy
Good point! Thanks for the reminder.

Also, if you haven't heard (Arabia.com, I think), Russia is signing an oil deal with Yemen too. Russia's looking like they're trying to put the "pro-American" OPEC out of business and corner the energy market.

What we're seeing here is a warfare over a allegedly dwindling energy supply. If true, this is going to turn into one hell of a mess. WW III = war over energy supplies... :-(

37 posted on 01/26/2002 8:06:15 PM PST by Gemflint
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: Pokey78
In a blunt criticism of President Bush, Saudi Arabia's senior intelligence official today called Yasir Arafat, the Palestinian leader, "a man of peace"...

Yasir Arafat has never been a man of peace.

People who say he is are simply liars, or else define "peace" as killing everyone except Muslims.

38 posted on 01/26/2002 8:17:57 PM PST by EternalHope
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Gemflint
Good info.

We must always keep in mind that this is WWIII, with a focus on withering America's economic strength. This war is going to last for at least one generation.

While I have not seen specific stats, I estimate that perhaps half of the world's muslems are less than 20 y.o., 300,000,000 (omit most girls) little holy warriors. Most live in failed socio-economic systems where they have been taught that Americans plunder the earth's resources. (See AlGore and company for press release details.)

This war is coming to North America. Israel is their proving ground; Arafat is a pathetic, sick old man, doomed no matter what happens. The M.E. oil pipeline will be held as a weapon against us, again.

After their next successful attack against America, I vote for the release of a video showing most of eastern Arabia as a darkened glazed crater filled with radioactive saltwater, titled Gulf of Waslam, All ak barf. As Americans, Europeans, Russians, Japanese, etc., we are mortal enemies of pan-Islam. Either we go to war or the war will come to us. IMO, within 10 years, millions will die, during the coming world-wide depression (aka "inflationary recession"). CNN will see this as a rating war.

39 posted on 01/26/2002 8:25:48 PM PST by SevenDaysInMay
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: mvonfr
Translation: most Saudis think that only four terrorist teams were not enough.

But relations between the countries are good.

40 posted on 01/26/2002 8:27:14 PM PST by EternalHope
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-52 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson