[Billthedrill]

The idea that government causes order is bizarre.

No, it isn't, and if you think it is you clearly are looking at it from a very restricted point of view - the one I meant by the phrase "special pleading." Try Rousseau on the topic, and Locke, and Hume. Try Thomas Paine in The Rights of Man and the book he wrote that as an argument against, Edmund Burke's Reflections on the Revolution in France. It's a feature of nearly every theory of government and society from every side of the political spectrum; it is, after all, what government is for. If not that, then what?

[Architect]

Don't lecture me, buddy. I have read them. The first person on your list is the monster Rousseau, the most evil thinker of all time - Marx not excluded. I find it difficult to understand how anyone who posts on a conservative forum could cite him as as reference.

The rest of these people argue for limited government. Might make sense. The problem with limited government is that it turns, sooner or later, into unlimited government. And unlimited disorder.

You totally avoided talking to my example, BTW.

[Aurelius]

"... what government is for. If not that, then what?"

Government, and the state, of which government is the administrative arm, exist to enable a ruling class to live parasitically off of a class that labors and produces. So it was in the beginning, is now, and ever shall be.