[blam]

Within the last thirty days (or so) we had a posting here on FR of a recently discovered impact crater in Iraq that was dated at 2200BC. Will someone find and post that article to this thread?(Thanks) I'm a catasthropist and love to make these connections. BTW, I saw this one hour BBC documentary, excellent.

[blam]

May be of interest also.

[medved]

bookmark

[azhenfud]

Please remind me again what period Genesis Chapter 41 represents. Could this also be the famine you refer to?
Az

[foolscap]

bump

[denydenydeny]

Dismissed as exaggeration and fantasy by most other Egyptologists, Fekri was determined to prove the writings were true and accurate.

CAN'T ANYONE WRITE SENTENCES BETTER THAN THIS MONSTROSITY ANYMORE??

< /compulsive grammarian>

[First_Salute]

Valles Caldera

I wonder that the Valles Caldera of the Jemez Mountain Range, though now classified as "resurgent," was initiated by impact.

I suspect that an impact where the Earth's magma subsurface level is "just right," effectively "fractures" the crust of the earth and in slow motion, resembles something like this:

Combine High Speed and Time Lapse, BMumford.com

Ulysses Patera on Mars, showing two impact craters of later dates than the resurgent structure.

The smaller impacts did not cause "fractures." While the larger, older impact did, causing a large outward plume, some of which then collapsed back upon the hole, the heat and heat of vibration smoothing the matter --- whereas in the case of the Valles Caldera, the resulting splash is Redondo:

It's just a theory.

[gitmo]

Here is the schedule of mini-ice ages that destroy civilizations (according to the author's numbers):

4200 years ago
2700 years ago
1200 years ago
300 years from now

We need to drive SUVs and use freon as much as possible or we are DOOMED. DOOMED I TELL YOU!

[6ppc]

indexing

[Justa]

". . . and from heaven a great star shall fall on the dread ocean and burn up the deep sea, with Babylon itself and the land of Italy, by reason of which many of the Hebrews perished...."

"And then in his anger the immortal God who dwells on high shall hurl from the sky a fiery bolt on the head of the unholy: and summer shall change to winter in that day."

-1918 translation of the "Sibylline" by H.N. Bate.

"From peak to loftiest peak the earth takes fire,
And cracks and splits, as all its saps suspire.
Grass wilts; and with their leaves the tree trunks flare;
And cornfields feed the flame that leaves them bare.
Small matters these--walled cities melt away;
Whole tribes and peoples turn to ashes gray;
The mountain masses with their forests burn:
Athos and Oete; Tmolus in his turn;
And Taurus smokes upon Cilicia's shore;
And Ida's many fountains gush no more;
Cynthus and Othrys, Haemus, yet unknown,
And Eryx burns, and virgin Helicon;
Parnassus lifts his two candescent spires;
And Etna streams with duplicated fires;
Dindyma, Mycale, and Mimas glow;
And Rhodope must shed her ancient snow;
Not Scythia's native frosts can keep her free;
Cithaeron, not his native sanctity;
And Pindus burns with Ossa, mighty names,
And mightier yet than both, Olympus flames;
Cold Caucasus with conflagration shines,
Air-piercing Alps, and cloud-capped Apennines.
Thus Phaethon, where'er he turns his gaze,
On every side beholds the world ablaze;
And faint, and breathing air at furnace heat,
He feels the car red-hot beneath his feet.
Wrapped in a pitchy pall of blinding smoke,
While cast-up ash and cinders sear and choke,
He knows not where he is, nor whither bound,
Dragged by the horses where they choose the ground.
Robbed, by the heat, of moisture, Libya's plain
Turned then to desert, ne'er to bloom again;
And as the sun-burned blood boiled up, they say,

-Ovid, The Metamorphoses

[Ciexyz]

Iraqi crater bump. Interesting read.

[William Terrell]

There are a lot of posts deleted on this thread. The replys indicate some were harmless and by more than one person. Why were they deleted?

[JasonC]

Too many explanations chase way too many events. Name a 500 year period when an ancient civilization *didn't* decline. (One or another). Civilizational decline is a normal and recurring process, not an accidental one. Most of the reasons for them are historical, roughly divided between external politics aka changes in empire, military, etc, and internal difficulties aka governance, order, etc.

Imagine infatuated future historians looking back at the 20th century. Hear all that global warming talk, those graphs of CO2 spikes around mid century? Obviously the cause of the fall of German civilization... (sic)

[razorbak]

Genesis 41:15 And Pharaoh said to Joseph, "I have had a dream, and there is no one who can interpret it. But I have heard it said of you that you can understand a dream, to interpret it."
16 So Joseph answered Pharaoh, saying, "It is not in me; God will give Pharaoh an answer of peace."
17 Then Pharaoh said to Joseph: "Behold, in my dream I stood on the bank of the river.
18 "Suddenly seven cows came up out of the river, fine looking and fat; and they fed in the meadow.
19 "Then behold, seven other cows came up after them, poor and very ugly and gaunt, such ugliness as I have never seen in all the land of Egypt.
20 "And the gaunt and ugly cows ate up the first seven, the fat cows.
21 "When they had eaten them up, no one would have known that they had eaten them, for they were just as ugly as at the beginning. So I awoke.
22 "Also I saw in my dream, and suddenly seven heads came up on one stalk, full and good.
23 "Then behold, seven heads, withered, thin, and blighted by the east wind, sprang up after them.
24 "And the thin heads devoured the seven good heads. So I told this to the magicians, but there was no one who could explain it to me."
25 Then Joseph said to Pharaoh, "The dreams of Pharaoh are one; God has shown Pharaoh what He is about to do:
26 "The seven good cows are seven years, and the seven good heads are seven years; the dreams are one.
27 "And the seven thin and ugly cows which came up after them are seven years, and the seven empty heads blighted by the east wind are seven years of famine.
28 "This is the thing which I have spoken to Pharaoh. God has shown Pharaoh what He is about to do.
29 "Indeed seven years of great plenty will come throughout all the land of Egypt;
30 "but after them seven years of famine will arise, and all the plenty will be forgotten in the land of Egypt; and the famine will deplete the land.
31 "So the plenty will not be known in the land because of the famine following, for it will be very severe.
32 "And the dream was repeated to Pharaoh twice because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass.
33 "Now therefore, let Pharaoh select a discerning and wise man, and set him over the land of Egypt.
34 "Let Pharaoh do this, and let him appoint officers over the land, to collect one-fifth of the produce of the land of Egypt in the seven plentiful years.
35 "And let them gather all the food of those good years that are coming, and store up grain under the authority of Pharaoh, and let them keep food in the cities.
36 "Then that food shall be as a reserve for the land for the seven years of famine which shall be in the land of Egypt, that the land may not perish during the famine."..................55 So when all the land of Egypt was famished, the people cried to Pharaoh for bread. Then Pharaoh said to all the Egyptians, "Go to Joseph; whatever he says to you, do."
56 The famine was over all the face of the earth, and Joseph opened all the storehouses and sold to the Egyptians. And the famine became severe in the land of Egypt.
57 So all countries came to Joseph in Egypt to buy grain, because the famine was severe in all lands.

[VOA]

Oklahoma dirt-farmers know what happened to the Egyptians because "Sh-t happens".

[Fred Nerks]

http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2001/11/04/wmet04.xml&sSheet=/news/2001/11/04/ixhome

Oh well, better late than never LOL!

[GOPJ]

This fits. It's always seemed odd that large ancient urban centers would grow up in areas without water...

[SunkenCiv]

[SunkenCiv]

Disaster that struck the ancients
by Jessica Cecil
Thursday, July 26, 2001

Professor Fekri Hassan, from University College London, UK, wanted to solve the mystery, by gathering together scientific clues. His inspiration was the little known tomb in southern Egypt of a regional governor, Ankhtifi. The hieroglyphs there reported "all of Upper Egypt was dying of hunger to such a degree that everyone had come to eating their children". Dismissed as exaggeration and fantasy by most other Egyptologists, Fekri was determined to prove the writings were true and accurate. He also had to find a culprit capable of producing such misery. He studied the meticulous records, kept since the 7th Century, of Nile floods. He was amazed to see that there was a huge variation in the size of the annual Nile floods - the floods that were vital for irrigating the land. But no records existed for 2,200BC. Then came a breakthrough - a new discovery in the hills of neighbouring Israel. Mira Bar-Matthews of the Geological Survey of Israel had found a unique record of past climates, locked in the stalactites and stalagmites of a cave near Tel Aviv. What they show is a sudden and dramatic drop in rainfall, by 20%. It is the largest climate event in 5,000 years. And the date? 2,200 BC.

[DarthVader]

Disaster that struck the ancients = Liberals

[Stultis]

severe climate change causing widespread human misery 4,200 years ago

Exciting finding. This pushes back the origin of the SUV by over 4,100 years!