Info on Smallpox vaccine for freepers

Centers for Disease Control ^ | Bones

[bonesmccoy]

Just wanted to leave you all some info on Vaccinia vaccination. Basically, last I heard the small pox immunization was not being produced in the USA. There was a report today that DOD has ordered supplies from UK. Frankly, I don't know how the UK could be producing the vaccine. The only known stockpiles of the virus (after World Health Organization/UN announced eradication of the virus from Earth) were in the US and USSR. If a UK company is making vaccine, what is in the vaccine?

The old vaccine was produced using techniques that would not be licensed or approved today. So, the stockpile doesn't meet current specs. Also, my info was that the stockpile is about 20 years old.

I don't know about you guys, but I'm not about to use 20-year-old vaccine in my practice without knowing that the vaccine was needed. I certainly would not use it in our children, unless I was convinced that a threat exists.

I do have the scar from the smallpox vaccine on my arm. My doctor gave it to me in the late 1970's. So, I feel a certain measure of comfort from that knowledge. However, it is important to note that the immunologic effect of the vaccine wanes (decreases) over the years.

Talking-heads on CNN et al have been stating that those who received the vaccine may not be immune. Well, I would like to point out to those @%^*!s that the original small pox vaccine was a LIVE VIRUS. That's why your skin ended up with welts, sores, and then scarred for life. The Japanese used the Oka Chicken Pox Vaccine for 20 years before the US gov't finally got it released to our nation. Have the Japanese seen any waning immunity from Oka Varicella Zoster Vaccine (the chickenpox vaccine)? NO! Yet, there are still idiot talking-heads who are PAID to show up on some news program and to spout incorrect info that the OkaVZV vaccine has concerns about waning immunity. ACCORDING TO WHOM?

The FDA can find an answer to the question of waning smallpox immunity real fast. THOMPSON NEEDS TO TELL CDC TO COMMISSION A FOLLOW-UP STUDY ON THE OLD SMALLPOX IMMUNIZATION. Have CDC draw serum samples on our generation of kids (who got the vaccine when we were young and are now consenting adults). Confirm when the patient received the vaccine and check the sample for any antibodies to smallpox. If you find IgG antibodies (assuming we know how to locate such antibodies, which I can not vouch for), then you will know if boosters are needed in previously immunized individuals.

Vaccinia Vaccine

Vaccinia (smallpox) vaccine, a licensed product, is a preparation of infectious vaccinia virus whose origin and manipulation is FDA approved. The vaccinia is grown in the skin of a vaccinated bovine calf (2). In 1982, the only active licensed producer of vaccinia vaccine in the United States, Wyeth Laboratories, discontinued production for general use, and, in 1983, distribution to the civilian population was discontinued. Smallpox vaccination has not been required for international travelers since January 1982, and International Certificates of Vaccination no longer include smallpox vaccination.

CDC provides vaccinia vaccine for laboratory workers directly involved with smallpox or closely related orthopox viruses (e.g., monkeypox and vaccinia). Due to clinical trials involving recombinant vaccinia virus vaccines, health-care workers (e.g., physicians and nurses) may now be exposed to vaccinia and recombinant vaccinia viruses and should be considered for vaccinia vaccination (6).

There is no evidence that smallpox vaccination has any therapeutic value in the treatment or prevention of recurrent herpes simplex infection, warts, oral thrush, or any other diseases (6). Requests for smallpox vaccine for these unapproved uses cannot be granted.

[bonesmccoy]

Yes, physicians have been directed to halt routine immunization of all children with tetanus boosters. I think it's stupid to NOT booster our kids. So, I disregarded that piece of advice from CDC and gave it to the few adolescents we have in our practice (3 doses). I had a bottle of vaccine we were keeping for rainy days...just call me Noah!

[Mo1]

My first question is .. Who owns Wyeth .. that in itself may answer a few questions regarding the problems with them ..

[nopardons]

My mother, who was vacinated in the early '20's, got her shot behind her left knee. That was the norm then ( and the governement didn't dictate where the shot had to be ) for girls, so that they wouldn't be scared on the arm. My materal grandmother , OTOH, has a scar in her left arm ; just as I have.

[Mo1]

Ok .. I gotta get to bed .. very interesting thoughts here .. I will be back tomorrow to finish reading ..

Nite all ..

[Octar]

However, it is important to note that the immunologic effect of the vaccine wanes (decreases) over the years.

Please tell me how you know this to be true. I am not disputing your statement, but I have searched for information on this subject and the best I turned up said that nobody knows if old vaccinations are still good. I had mine in the late '30s. I also had chickenpox. Thanks.

[bonesmccoy]

Hey Fitz!

Thanks for the info from CDC. I was searching their site earlier today and couldn't locate the info you posted. Many thanks. Many of us younger doctors have never seen smallpox, anthrax, or even measles because the last cases of these diseases in the US pre-date even the most experienced physicians.

I checked the index of the most current pediatric textbooks. There are NO entries for Anthrax in the current edition of Rudolph's. I'm sure that will change in the next edition.

[bonesmccoy]

I've been attempting to get info on that. Some companies are privately owned. If you get any info on the board of directors of Wyeth, I'd sure appreciate reading it!

[bonesmccoy]

Yes, Influenza vaccine from one company was in shorter supply. However, Aventis is delivering well. Everyone ought to be getting this vaccine this year. You don't need to be confused between Influenza and this other stuff this year.

[nopardons]

Any person, who is not vacinated against smallpox , has the oppertunity to catch this disease , of they are exposed to a contagious person .

I hope that your daughter is doing well now.

[FITZ]

You might have some immunity, they ---the CDC--says 10 years, but sometimes that's just a number, it can be longer for some. Even a little immunity is better than nothing. I'd try to get another vaccination to be on the safe side. I think there is only reason to have some concern but the vaccine production could be greatly speeded up, otherwise there's other ways if we really had to.

[dc-zoo]

I do believe he stayed in a holiday inn "express" last night but he does have some mighty good info.

[Humidston]

Thanks for sharing this valuable information! I've been reading (but quietly) and am bookmarking this thread!

Again, THANK YOU! Please stay in touch!

[Exigence]

then I should be able to order the vaccine and administer it to your children.

Haven't I heard several comments from the medical community on the mortality of smallpox vaccines in young children? The estimates is that we could have in the neighborhood of 2000 deaths, if I remember correctly. It seems a little risk analysis needs to be done -- especially since the vaccine can be given after exposure for a few days and still be effective in preventing the disease. I'm not so sure I would vaccinate my children without a clear threat in sight.

[KQQL]

I didn't say he had bad info.

[nopardons]

I, as many of my generation , was vacinated as a baby, and have had at least one booster. I certainly hope that I am covered for the rest of my life.

[bonesmccoy]

No. I am assuming that CDC has that under their consideration and that the vaccine production would further neutralize any agents. However, I am not a prion investigator.

[bonesmccoy]

Risk analysis? If you have an outbreak and you want to stop it, doing statistics on risk/benefit is best left to the same prof's who are paid to pontificate (while the rest of us are ACTUALLY on the front line of the effort). If you want to withhold a life-saving vaccine from your family, be my guest. You'll just need to sign a waiver in our office (waiving us from any future litigation when you realize all too late that you "chose poorly".)

[bonesmccoy]

Yes you would be...you lucky dog.

[bonesmccoy]

you don't get info and wisdom from sleeping at a H-Inn. take your belittling comments to another thread. There are doctors and health care professionals in this thread. Your disinformation tactic is counterproductive.

[AmericanGurl]

You both have helped me tremendously. While I'm still fearful of smallpox I'm breathing a little easier knowing my baby, if necessary and available, could get vaccinated.

God Bless!