Majority of New Zealanders back military support for US: poll

yahoo ^ | October 1 | AFP

[super175]

AUCKLAND, Oct 1 (AFP) - Two out of three New Zealanders think their government should offer military support to the United States in its war on terrorism, a newspaper poll showed Monday.

Despite its modern-day anti-nuclear stance, New Zealand has a history of military support for its western allies, as was shown in World War I and World War II, the Vietnam and Korean wars as well as the more recent Gulf and Bosnian conflicts.

The New Zealand Herald survey of 552 people between September 28 and 30 showed 67 percent were in favour of offering military support, 27 percent were opposed and six percent were unsure.

The poll found 58 percent supported US military action in retribution for the September 11 terror attacks on the World Trade Centre and the Pentagon.

Just 25 percent were against military action, and 18 percent were unsure.

The results also found 61 percent of respondents wanted New Zealand to become an active member of ANZUS again.

ANZUS, the Australia, New Zealand and United States Alliance, is a security pact signed by the three states in 1952. It was weakened when New Zealand refused to allow nuclear-powered or nuclear-armed vessels into its waters three decades later.

Seventy-five percent said armed security guards should be present on overseas flights. The attacks have had a dramatic effect on international travel plans, with 12 percent of Kiwis saying they will cancel trips scheduled over the coming months.

On Friday, Prime Minister Helen Clark reinforced New Zealand's commitment to US action, saying: "The international effort to deal to terrorism, which New Zealand supports, will be ongoing, multifaceted and prolonged."

[Proudtobeakiwi]

"Our SAS troops are the main part of what has been offered. Helen likes to focus on that - "But we HAVE offered support. We've offered our SAS troops". NZ's SAS has "70 to 100 troops" (NZ Herald, 2 October 2001). Wow, generous contribution there Helen. " That's a little unfair - Our SAS troops are renowned for being one of the world's best outfits and the best at things like search and locate - we train other outfits around the world in this. So committing these troops will be a real plus for the operation.

[shaggy eel]

,,, just as "Blunder" has to learn to think, the labour government is still trying to understand business. The politics of moving ahead is quite foreign to left wing minds here.

[mgstarr]

"the NZ SAS are a better unit than any special forces the US has"

And you are basing this on which series of military engagements? If you told me that British SAS or Israeli Commando were better (man for man) I might be convinced, but I'm not aware of many intense battles over the last 30 years that NZ SAS took part.

[Snuffington]

People won't like to hear it here, but the NZ SAS are a better unit than any special forces the US has, whether Green Berets, Rangers, SEALS, Delta Force or whatever.

I'm not sure of the quality of the NZ SAS. But I do know that the U.S. (at least during the Bush I administration) had special forces that would shame any others in the world. And they didn't go by any of the names you listed above. They were the elite from these elite branches. After 8 years of Clinton, who knows what's left of them.

In any case, the NZ SAS is welcome to show us all what they're worth. If only their leftist PM will let them.

[Blunderfromdownunder]

Right then, numbers for those shooting off their mouths with no basis in fact
From the horses mouth NZ defence spending fell by 18 percent in real terms from 1991-1997 under the National (Conservative) Government. Net funding for the military will increase by $300mil over the next 5 years, $700mil over the next ten years under the Labour(Social democrat) Government. Additional captital constributions will be required over the next ten years, boosting capital expenditure in that period to $2 bil.

From Hardnews 11-05-01
"For 30 years the Skyhawks, which take 14% of our defence budget, have had no involvement in what our defence forces actually do. They have never been in combat, they have never provided air cover for our troops, anywhere. Our Army hardly ever exercises with them and apart from flying air shows their main public role is in pretending to attack Australian navy ships. They would have cost nearly a billion dollars to maintain over the next decade - and as much again would have had to have been put aside for a replacement fleet.
The money saved will be ploughed into the remaining defence forces, alongside another $700 million in additional operating funding and an extra billion dollars in capital spending. This still does not make us a big spender in international terms but there is no reason we should be.
As might have been expected, Opposition parties rose as one in their condemnation of the plan. Jenny Shipley declared that selling off the Skyhawks plunged New Zealand into life with a "second-rate" defence force. She apparently believes that sending our soldiers to Timor with radios that date back to the Vietnam war, as National did, was "first rate".

[Blunderfromdownunder]

Special forces tend not to take part in "intense battles"; thats what the regular forces are for. Our SAS have been involved in Timor, Iraq, Malaya, Vietnam, Northern Ireland and various other undisclosed hotpsots (SF tend only to make the news when the stuff up big time); Our SAS teach alpine ops and tracking to the British and Australian SAS and American SF, among others. How many times must I post this stuff (There is none so blind as those that will not see)

And jeez man, if you have such a problem with the NZ government why are you even emigrating down here? At least show the courage of your (political)convictions and stay where you are (Or are you coming down here to convert our ignorant population of socialist sheeple? Have I hit upon your cunning plan?)

[shaggy eel]

,,, it took you four hours to come back with that? They will have to move a little faster at the Party office for you.

There's no doubt that the Skyhawks were at the end of their operational life, I'll grant you that.

Will Helen keep that very loyal Orion to get her back from Aussie next time she's under siege in Melbourne's transit lounge or will the army build a Bayley bridge over the Tasman?

[shaggy eel]

,,, stop being a mother to the world Blunderer. There will be a change of government before mgstarr gets here - there's none so blind as you who will not see.

[Blunderfromdownunder]

You are a laugh riot Shagger; Which government began the privatisation, tariff reductions, and welfare state dismantling in the late eighties, embracing neo-conservative/monetarist economic policies??

[Blunderfromdownunder]

Shaggs, some of us have work to do and cant spend all day sitting on our buts grazing at Freerepublic.

[FReethesheeples]

Good:

Only, "Pro-Terrorist ersatz Pacifist Krypto-Nazi Camel Butt Traitors Demand America Surrender to Terrorists."

[shaggy eel]

,,, those who have their time managed well can do whatever they want Blunder. Better luck in your next life, huh?

[Kiwigal]

My point was really that if 70-100 people is all she's offering, it looks a little sad. I was not at all trying to criticise the SAS, they are one of the best parts of the defence forces. But I am not sure that it is enough to offer just that. And, apart from intelligence assistance, it appears that's all we have offered.

[Blunderfromdownunder]

Sorry Shazza, in my world the working day tends to be just that, aside from occasional, brief respites

[Bob J]

You want to see free for alls, mention California, and we're part of the UNION! Heheh.

There are lots of knuckleheads here, just ignore/correct them, trudge on and you'll find diamond after diamond. That's what most of us do.

BTW - We'll need to see some of your countrymen in action or you may be eating more crow.

[mgstarr]

Oh my, slayed again by your rapier wit.....

Apart from Comrade Helen, you seem to be the only other ignorant Kiwi socialist I can think of offhand. Fortunately you and your cohorts will be tossed out again at the next general election.

[Kiwigal]

Hear hear!! And Blunder - you know what they say about all work no play...although we are flattered that you would spend your playtime chatting with raving right-wingers, perhaps you are wavering in your political orientation somewhat? More power to you! Nothing would give me more pleasure than to wave bye-bye to Helen at the next election....so long as we are waving hello to Jenny (or Bill) or Richard and not Jim or Jeanette (god forbid!!)

[shaggy eel]

,,, that change of government concept has you worried, doesn't it?

[Blunderfromdownunder]

I would watch out, that "we" you use sounds a mite collectivist. Actually, I voted National/Act in 1996 but never again...The way National jumped into bed with NZ First left a bad taste in my mouth. Jenny Shipley is an empty vessel and Prebble is a venal populist, almost as bad as Winnie. Bill English might be a different story; the fact that he has yet to stab Jenn in the back like she did to Bolger might suggest he has some scruples. I like to read Freerepublic/Townhall etc to avoid confirmation bias.