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To: canuck_conservative

Russia invaded Ukraine on Feb. 23rd, starting this stupid war
————-
The Ukies started this war back in 2015 when they started shelling the eastern ethnic Russian provinces, Donetsk city areas primarily.

The UN acknowledges this ( and their war crimes) thus the unnatural silence from them on this war. In fact, the UN had supported an independent Lughansk and Donetsk, fully autonomous within the borders of Ukraine.

…and there you go, like Paul Harvey used to say, “ tge rest of the story”.


87 posted on 09/08/2022 4:50:15 PM PDT by delta7
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To: delta7

That’s complete bollocks, straight outta Kremlin.

Russia violated the Budapest Memorandum undertakings when it poisoned Yanukovych’s electoral rival to help him get over tge line (unnecessary as he won the election fair and square).

Russia further violated the agreement, and its undertakings from the formation of the Commonwealth of Independent States, by using Yanukovych and Azarov to mothball the Europeanisation movement in 2013.

It further violated those undertakings when Putin and Yanukovych did a deal behind closed doors in December 2013 that handed Russia proxy control over Ukraine’s debts - in return for which Yanukovych was expecting to become Ukraine’s equivalent of Belarus’ Lukashenko.

Russia violated it even further by sending in thousands of troops into the Donbass, without insignia - including Nazis, Wagner mercs and regulars “on holiday” - to artificially increase the size of the separatist movement.

The referenda were illegitimate and unconstitutional. Not only did they block thousands of Luhansk and Donestk citizens with a right to vote in it from voting, the Russian proxies who had no right to participate in it, did get to participate. The Ukrainian Constitution forbade that. The UN said the voting seemed fair but also saw big shenanigans, and hence saw through Russia’s backdoor annexation attempt.

The sum of all that’s why the UN both rejected the referenda results and the separatist declarations, but also bollocked Russia.

Russia’s annexation of Crimea violated the UN Charter, the Budapest Memorandum, and the joint declarations at the end of the Soviet Union.

The civil war between 2014 and 2019 was not instigated by the Ukes attacking Russian speakers - it was instigated by Ukraine finally snapping after putting up with YEARS of Russian separatists backed by Russian irregulars repeatedly breaking multiple international and regional agreements in order to drag the Donbas out of Ukraine and into Russia.

If Donetsk and Luhansk truly wanted to be as autonomous as Crimea, given that the Azarov government and Yanukovych were pro Russian they already had a constitutionally sound, peaceful way to do it that would have violated no treaties or foundational principles on Ukrainian sovereignty.

1. “Advisory” referenda on devolution/autonomy.
2. Present results to Rada.

3. Get a >50% majority of Rada to agree to a constitutional amendment moving from unitary statehood to Federal Republic, to make this transition possible for ALL Oblasts.

4. All Ukraine referendum on federalism.

5. Reconstitute Ukraine as a federal republic with every Oblast having the freedoms that Crimea already had.


90 posted on 09/09/2022 12:12:08 AM PDT by MalPearce
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