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I'm deliberately not posting a long excerpt from this article because it starts with a very long argument FOR abortion being legal, before transitioning to a very convincing argument against it.

As a committed pro-lifer I naturally disagree with the first part, though I agree with the author that the argument she makes probably is about the best argument the pro-abortion side could possibly muster.

Her point is that pro-lifers should be able to face that argument, and I am. Even if the numbers she cites were accurate (and I strongly suspect they are grossly exaggerated) I believe the argument she makes against abortion (that it is undeniably a child's life) would trump those arguments.

I feel like the author was strongly pro-abortion (and that explains why she's so familiar with statistics about illegal abortions prior to Roe v Wade) but a sonogram of a 12 week old baby is changing her mind.

The best quote "And I held on to that comforting piece of information, until it occurred to me to look at one of those images taken at the end of the first trimester. I often wish I hadn’t."

I recommend reading this piece as a good preparation for actually trying to change the mind of someone who is pro-abortion.

1 posted on 11/12/2019 12:29:09 PM PST by edwinland
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To: edwinland

When someone has molded their conscience to accept the wanton killing of pre born human life, they can never be trusted in any matter .They are capable of accommodating any moral abomination. It is wise to have only the most superficial relationship with such people and only then when it is absolutely necessary.

Also as an aside to women with children who have had an abortion. It is not wise to share this fact with your surviving children. They will never look at you the same again.


2 posted on 11/12/2019 12:49:24 PM PST by allendale (.)
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To: edwinland

C’mon men it’s in your hands. Use it wisely. Don’t allow your seed to go into an idiot/monster. Do not get to the point where a eugenicist’s puppet is slaughtering your son/daughter. Think with your big head. Thanks.


4 posted on 11/12/2019 12:59:56 PM PST by PGalt
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To: edwinland

I read only part of the article. Back in the 60’s and earlier, you can kind of understand why a woman would be so desperate to get rid of a baby, there was so much stigma attached to being an unwed mother. Nowadays, there is no such stigma, none. Nobody cares. Quite the opposite, as in some circles, it’s a point of honor to be unmarried and pregnant. There is no excuse in this day and age to get an abortion unless it’s pure selfishness.


5 posted on 11/12/2019 1:07:48 PM PST by tuffydoodle (God's character and moral nature are absolute, eternal, and unchanging.)
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To: edwinland
I am staunch pro-life, but I understand that my position is based at least in part on religious belief.

There is a period from conception until some certain point, where being pro-life is based on faith, the belief that that fetus has a soul. But after that point being pro-life is simple human goodness.

I can understand why someone who does not believe in a soul would not have a problem with early abortion, but not later.

I don't know when that period when it changes from a religious belief to a matter of simple humanity. Is it when a heartbeat is detectable? Is it when the nervous system is functional? I don't know, but I think that is where the battle is fight-able. There really is no way that abortion will be made completely illegal, anyone who thinks it can is kidding themselves. But I think it is possible to seriously limit the number of abortions by banning it after a certain point.
6 posted on 11/12/2019 1:13:18 PM PST by MMaschin (The difference between strategy and tactics!)
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To: edwinland

A few years ago I heard Ben Shapiro at National Right to Life. He gave, really and truly, without mischaracterization and without condescension, the “best” arguments from the other side.

It was excellent.

Then he proceeded to devastatingly take down each argument with logic, humor, compassion, wit and moral clarity. It was superb.

The point being, we need not fear the best arguments from the other side. We should in fact do more of exactly what Shapiro did. Address them without mischaracterization head on.


7 posted on 11/12/2019 1:16:23 PM PST by ConservativeDude
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To: edwinland

People who get, or perform, an abortion, a person who tries to commit suicide, and a murderer believe in the same horrible lie that “Some lives do not matter.”


8 posted on 11/12/2019 1:18:30 PM PST by ksc (Abortion, Suicide, Murders)
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To: edwinland

Frankly, I have found that it is truly a fools errand to try and convince a pro-abortionist that it’s practice is wrong.

They are pro-abortion predominantly because it makes THEIR life easier, more convenient and with far less responsibility for their actions. They only try and argue it’s overall acceptability to justify that.

What “statistics” could possibly be quoted that would justify the mass murder of the unborn???

To try and convince them otherwise is much like trying to convince an atheist to believe in God and practice Christianity.

A person may have an epiphany on the subject as a handful of ex pro-abortionists have over the years but it must come from within.....It must grow out of a foundational change in their heart and soul either from a spiritual awakening or a life changing external event.


11 posted on 11/12/2019 1:27:16 PM PST by traderrob6
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To: edwinland; ConservativeMind; ealgeone; Gamecock; HarleyD; Luircin; aMorePerfectUnion; boatbums; ...
I feel like the author was strongly pro-abortion (and that explains why she's so familiar with statistics about illegal abortions prior to Roe v Wade) but a sonogram of a 12 week old baby is changing her mind.

Rather, if you read further on then you should see that the author is advocating for abortion, despite the gross nature of it, because the end justifies the means:

And here is one truth: No matter what the law says, women will continue to get abortions. How do I know? Because in the relatively recent past, women would allow strangers to brutalize them, to poke knitting needles and wire hangers into their wombs, to thread catheters through their cervices and fill them with Lysol, or scalding-hot water, or lye. Women have been willing to risk death to get an abortion. When we made abortion legal, we decided we weren’t going to let that happen anymore.

Which argument is absurd, akin to arguing that "since Zyklon B results in too many deaths of Nazis then we need to find a safer was of exterminating Jews." The point being that while the effect or illegal abortions are often deleterious to the mother, the solution is not to make the murder of infants safer.

Instead, why not deal with the reasons why women get abortions, from fornication to selfishly not wanting children to difficulties in adoption.

22 posted on 11/14/2019 4:16:14 AM PST by daniel1212 ( Trust the risen Lord Jesus to save you as a damned and destitute sinner + be baptized + follow Him)
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