America Is Stuck With a $400 Billion Stealth Fighter That Can’t Fight

Daily Beast ^ | 6/13/2019 | David Axe

[Zhang Fei]

[Irrelevant.. do some research.

F-35 has been a a POS since inception and like all liberal social programs throwing money at this hasn’t worked either.]

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Just how much time have I spent reading about the F-35, off and on? Many more hours than I should have. I’m gonna estimate 40 hours, in total, mostly in forum.

[Bonemaker]

That’s what happens when you try to make a “multirole” fighter with a gazillion international subcontractors. I feel bad for the pilots and crews who have to fly and maintain these turds.

[Alas Babylon!]

The Viet Cong didn't have aircraft; especially fighters—that was the North Vietnamese, who had MiG 21’s, and it was the F-4s under Colonel Robin Olds, in Operation Bolo, to fool the MiG pilots into thinking the F-4’s were F-105s, and when they came out to shoot down the Thuds, the F-4’s came off the deck and totally WAXED the MiGs.

So, you think the F-35 is a dog because of the same reasons that made the F-4 a dog, BUT, the F-4 wasn't a dog, due to American ingenuity and spirit working to fix the errors...

Relax, I truly believe the F-35 will also play out the same.

[Bonemaker]

“...due to American ingenuity and spirit working to fix the errors...”

Yeah like finally figuring out to actually put guns on them.

[papertyger]

I’m gonna believe military incompetence issues from a source that can’t distinguish between a sporting rifle, and an assault rifle?

[Bonemaker]

Too bad Kelly Johnson isn’t still around....P 38, P 80, SR 71...

[Sequoyah101]

Yup. It has been a serious fxxxed up POS for a long time and every bit of information that comes out about it is worse than the information before. Every war game scenario involves US losing to the chicoms.

The F-35 is a loser and will get people killed and fast and is a waste of money. Time to cut losses, end the program, lick the wounds and buy a ship load of F-15s and restart the F-22 line on the basis of a national emergency. It is obvious.

Lockheed has no business building anything for the military.

[ExTxMarine]

How many military members have to DIE while others have to figure out solutions that wouldn’t exist if they didn’t try packing 20 pounds of shit into a 5 pound device!

And for the price we pay for these combat systems, we shouldn’t have to have high school graduate mechanics figuring out mechanical problems caused by college educated idiots!

But hey, in time and a few deaths later it will all be worth their lives, huh?!? I guess some military members deaths are worth the end-results of a great combat weapons system.

[Secret Agent Man]

They still crash.

[Don W]

Show me ONE airframe in use that has never fallen out of the sky.

[Secret Agent Man]

Not the point. I dont believe they have all the bugs out of them to where they are a generally accepted stable platform.

[CJ Wolf]

The list goes on. But we build a better bird learning each time.

[CJ Wolf]

How else will we get the new f-45

[cherry]

all is not lost....just think of how many billionaires we made by wasting this money....

[21twelve]

I’m guessing that every airplane trades off less “x” for more “y”, and that there are certain things you can’t do in each plane. But - you work around them.

[daniel1212]

. All I can say is that about 30 years ago, when the web was just invented, every major US weapon system used during the Gulf War was pilloried by journalists.

Not quite that bad, but here is one from the NYT (concerning an an Iraqi invasion of Saudi Arabia :CONFRONTATION IN THE GULF; Disadvantage for U.S. in the Desert: Fewer Tanks By MALCOLM W. BROWNEAUG. 25, 1990 .

On the desert sand that covers most of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Iraq, wheeled vehicles bog down quickly. An infantryman slogging through ankle-deep sand can run no more than a few hundred yards before becoming exhausted.

Adding to American problems would be the erosive effects of sand and heat on machinery and morale, as well as the threat of poison gas.

''Old-time armor commanders used to think of deserts as ideal battlegrounds for tanks,'' an Israeli military expert said. ''But don't expect to see great tank battles in the Arabian Peninsula.''

But at least one leading expert said he believed that good intelligence and air superiority may not in themselves assure a quick American victory. That expert, Donn A. Starry, a retired United States Army general who commanded tank forces in Korea, Europe and Vietnam as well as the Army's Armored Center at Fort Knox, Ky., said Iraq's 5,500 Soviet-designed tanks could pose a serious threat.

American ground commanders are counting heavily on infantry missiles to stop Iraqi tanks. But the effectiveness of those weapons - notably the tube-launched, optically tracked, wire-guided TOW missile and the Dragon wire-guided missile - is questioned by many experts.

Despite the problems, ''the odds are certainly in our favor,'' an American analyst said. ''But it would be foolhardy for anyone to assume that Iraq would be a pushover,'' the analyst continued. ''If we fight them, we'd better be sure we're prepared to stick out a tough one.''

[TXnMA]

"Seemed to me the F-22 was a pretty nice platform before Obama shut it down."

Yep, and had all the tooling destroyed so more can't be built.

Also, it has zero problems with melting -- and can "slightly" '-) exceed a 20-degree angle of attack...

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/B4243E/modern-and-stealth-american-jet-fighter-f-22a-raptor-on-cobra-maneuver-B4243E.jpg (Alamy photo: can't post here.)

.. and still keep on fighting.

[Alas Babylon!]

That’s such an emotional and insulting lie! I don’t want anyone to die!

Look, you read in the Washington Post that Trump colluded with Russia. Do you believe that?

You watch CNN and they say Trump committed Obstruction of Justice. Do you believe that???

How about what the New York Times, MSNBC, the Atlantic, the National Review, Time Magazine, NPR or a thousand other media outlets? Do you believe them???

So why do you believe the media when they talk about all the flaws in weapon systems?

This “article” is from the Daily Beast, a democrat propaganda shit blog. DO NOT BELIEVE IT even if they tell you the sky is blue!

Perhaps, just perhaps, the F-35 is a fine aircraft. Perhaps the so-called flaws are gross exaggerations and outright lies.

I said up thread that I saw, last month—end of May, 2 O-4 USAF Captains who were wearing the f-35 Test Pilot patches in the Maxwell AFB BX. I’m retired USAF E-8 and I asked them if the F-35 was a piece of crap like all the press has been saying. They vehemently denied it and said the initially trained and flew the F-16 as Lt’s and thought the F-35 was much more capable.

Not once did they say it was substandard but they’d fix it all by-and-by. I was reflecting on what YOU said about the F-4, which was a FINE aircraft and in it’s day beat the pants off of Russian MiGs.

All I can tell you is do not ever accuse me of wanting my fellow GIs to die, or that I do not care if they do. That kind of personal attack isn’t warranted against a fellow veteran and FReeper.

Still, my whole military career and since I have retired the media has ALWAYS talked and wrote about the flaws of various United States weapon systems ad nauseum. According the them, over the years the following were pieces of shit that would break, fail, and kill GIs:

—Bradley Fighting Vehicle

—M1 Abrams tank

—A10

—Osprey V-22

—B-1 Bomber

—C-5 Galaxy

—C-17

—F-16 Lighting 2

—F-15 Eagle

—Etc., etc., etc.

[Future Snake Eater]

The Pentagon’s $400-billion F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program...

Try closer to a $1 trillion program.

[Future Snake Eater]

Sort of. Once the cover-ups that killed a lot of Marines were exposed (covered up by the USMC leadership, naturally), the problems were corrected. Now we have a fast insertion VTOL aircraft, but it can’t haul a whole lot—only about 22 fully-loaded personnel.