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To: kabar

I honestly think you are extrapolating the idea that poor immigrants will always be poor immigrants, and therefore their politics will remain Leftist/Socialist.

If that were the case, German immigrants of 1848 (basically Leftists who were defeated by Royalists); the Irish of the Potato Famine; later Italians, Serbs, Russians and Poles (who came in the late 1800s/early 1900s) would all be Eugene Debs socialists today...

They’re not. Some of these groups are the bedrock of modern conservative voters, and very much part of the Trump Triumph of 2016.

The only immigrant groups that stayed with their socialist roots have been European Jews and Scandinavians.

If your numbers are true, then we should work now to teach conservatism to the Hispanic immigrants, and ensure they leave their Social Justice Latin Catholicism behind them. I’m a catholic, but more on the line of John Paul II and Benedict 16. If they’re gonna stay in the Catholic Church it needs to be American Catholic, not Latin American. By the way, we have some LEGAL Mexicans in my church, and they only come to the English mass, and they like our very conservative priest!

Nothing in life comes easy, sorry to say. A tough order, but it can be done. We are, however, the United States of America, and I believe in American Exceptionalism—as spelled out in the Declaration of Independence. I don’t think you have to be a certain ethnic group to believe in it also.


115 posted on 04/30/2017 8:53:22 AM PDT by Alas Babylon! (Keep fighting the Left and their Fake News!)
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To: Alas Babylon!
By the way, we have some LEGAL Mexicans in my church, and they only come to the English mass, and they like our very conservative priest!

This is good news for you.

In my perish we have a Vietnamese Priest - you would think that with his communist experience as a child he would not be a Socialist. But no. He is in love with the local poor / migrant (some legal some not) Mexicans. So much so that the church school is in trouble. White parishioners are not given any breaks on their tuition while Mexican parents get a break. This has lead to major drop-of in church coffers.

Life goes on

138 posted on 04/30/2017 10:38:01 AM PDT by DanZ
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To: Alas Babylon!
I honestly think you are extrapolating the idea that poor immigrants will always be poor immigrants, and therefore their politics will remain Leftist/Socialist.

I have been having this discussion with the GOPe types who refuse to accept the facts and reality and cling to our past, often romanticized, immigration history that seems to hold it as a matter of faith that assimilation will take place and that importing more immigrants than we have ever had in our history, 87% of whom are minorities as classified by the USG, will not change this country and not in a good way.

We have just had three of the four highest decades of LEGAL immigration in our history. In 1970 one in 21 was foreign-born; today, it is a little less one in eight, the highest in 105 years; and by 2023, it will be one in 7, the highest in our history. Immigration drives 80% of our population growth. Since 1990 35 million legal permanent immigrants have entered this country or the equivalent of the current population of Canada. Immigrants are having a major electoral impact, which is why the Dems want more of them, legal and otherwise.

If that were the case, German immigrants of 1848 (basically Leftists who were defeated by Royalists); the Irish of the Potato Famine; later Italians, Serbs, Russians and Poles (who came in the late 1800s/early 1900s) would all be Eugene Debs socialists today...

I suggest you read Samuel Huntington's The Hispanic Challenge

"The persistent inflow of Hispanic immigrants threatens to divide the United States into two peoples, two cultures, and two languages. Unlike past immigrant groups, Mexicans and other Latinos have not assimilated into mainstream U.S. culture, forming instead their own political and linguistic enclaves -- from Los Angeles to Miami -- and rejecting the Anglo-Protestant values that built the American dream. The United States ignores this challenge at its peril."

I watched firsthand the transformation of VA from a reliable Rep state to a now blue state due to immigration. CA is the canary in the coal mine. The demographics of CA today will be those of the US in 2050. Do you think CA will be a conservative state anytime soon?

Nothing in life comes easy, sorry to say. A tough order, but it can be done. We are, however, the United States of America, and I believe in American Exceptionalism—as spelled out in the Declaration of Independence. I don’t think you have to be a certain ethnic group to believe in it also.

Yeah, I know how it goes, "Diversity is a strength." Well, I have news for you. No matter how "exceptional" we think we are, we are not immune to the tribal instincts that mark virtually every country on earth. The trend since WWII has been more tribalism, not less. The UN started with 51 founding members; we now have 193 member countries.

The numbers increased with the end of colonialism and the fall of the Soviet Union, but there have been other divisions having to do with race, ethnicity, language, culture, etc. not only in the Third World, but also, the developed world. Separatist movements exist in Spain, the UK, Holland, Belgium, Canada, and elsewhere. Czechoslovakia broke up. Scotland narrowly voted to remain in the UK. Brexit threatens the the existence of the EU as nationalist movements throughout Europe are rising in response to the massive influx of refugees and immigrants. Donald Trump benefited by his stances on immigration and trade.

The foreign-born population of the US was 9.2 million in 1970. It is now close to 45 million. We are witnessing one of the greatest peaceful mass migrations of people in history. People are not widgets or units of labor. They bring their own world view, culture, language, etc. And the numbers are so great that assimilation is becoming more and more problematic. Our educational system used to act as a vehicle for assimilation. Now it has become a way to divide people thru multiculturalism and diversity.

Studies have been done of immigrant children entering our schools identifying as Americans and leaving feeling as aggrieved members of an ethnic or racial minority. We incentivize these identities thru our policies that reward people with special privileges and rights whether it is affirmative action, minority business set asides, or election ballots in their native languages. We also make them victims of an oppressive white majority.

The Democrats have won the popular vote in 6 out of the last 7 Presidential elections. Hillary received 3 million more votes thanks to huge majorities from minority voters. The trend will only continue as each cohort that turns 18 annually is more minority than the previous one. One out of every four students in K-12 in a public school comes from a family where a language other than English is spoken at home.

Unless this country reduces significantly legal immigration into this country, we will see more and more a society divided along linguistic, cultural, racial, religious, and ethnic lines. A growing wealth distribution gap will exacerbate our problems as a permanent underclass populated primarily by blacks and Hispanics will fuel social unrest and discord. We will lose this country thru the ballot box.

161 posted on 04/30/2017 5:08:35 PM PDT by kabar
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