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Who Lost Turkey? (Revisited)
Steyn Online ^ | 17 Apr 2017 | Mark Steyn

Posted on 04/18/2017 7:10:33 AM PDT by Rummyfan

As they used to say way back when in the long Ottoman twilight, the Turk is the sick man of Europe. Following this weekend's Caliph-for-Life referendum, the Turk is sicker than ever. But he's no longer of Europe, and instead is exiting for a destination dark and catastrophic for almost all his neighbors.

Sultan Erdoğan - who, a mere 15 years ago, was banned from holding political office - has now succeeded in dismantling almost every defining element of the Kemalist republic. What replaces it will be a crude strongman state in service of Islamic imperialism. I have read a lot of commentary this morning, starting with Douglas Murray's "Turkish Democracy Has Just Died" and moving on to Yavuz Baydar's "The End Of Turkey As We Know It" via Alex Alexiev's "Who Lost Turkey?" And several readers have been kind enough to inquire where's my own "Who Lost Turkey?" piece. Well, the truth is I published it exactly ten years ago, to the day of Erdoğan's referendum.

(Excerpt) Read more at steynonline.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: caliphate; erdogan; muslimworld; nato; steyn; turkey; turkeyelection

1 posted on 04/18/2017 7:10:33 AM PDT by Rummyfan
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To: Rummyfan

If you look at the road ahead in Turkey, and if you were an educated Turk with some value in a job....then I’d probably put my resume out in Europe and leave Turkey. None of this business since the coup of last year gives you any incentive to stick around. A brain-drain will occur, and probably 25-percent of the more valuable engineers or doctors will probably leave over the next couple of years. If I were some young Turk in college....I wouldn’t waste any time looking for work in Turkey...I’d be planning on another career elsewhere.


2 posted on 04/18/2017 7:27:11 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: Rummyfan

Great piece by Mark Steyn on the changing demographics in Turkey.


3 posted on 04/18/2017 7:33:25 AM PDT by mac_truck (aide toi et dieu t'aidera)
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To: Rummyfan

Every word Steyn writes should be read.


4 posted on 04/18/2017 7:34:04 AM PDT by bicyclerepair (MAGA - DRAIN THE SWAMP ! - I love my online family of FReepers.)
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To: Rummyfan
Atatürk's modern secular Turkey has simply been outbred by fiercely Islamic Turkey.
Europe take note.

You can have a functioning democracy in a relatively homogeneous society in which parties compete over tax policy and health care. But, when a nation is divided into two groups with fundamentally opposing views of what that society is or should be, then democracy becomes tribal, and the size of the tribe determines the outcome.
Where the Democrats were taking us.

Ultimately, in Turkey as elsewhere, demography trumps democracy.
Key sentence.

5 posted on 04/18/2017 7:53:25 AM PDT by Oatka
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To: mac_truck
The only element missing from Steyn's column (and arguably, it's outside his narrative), is the neutering of the Turkish General Staff (TGS) under Erdoğan. For decades, the Turkish military, and its western-oriented leadership--the living embodiment of Attaturk's secular vision--were a stabilizing influence in the country, both politically and socially. And the TGS wasn't afraid to step in, when elected leaders strayed too far from the Attaturk blue print, or proved incompetent.

Unfortunately, Erdoğan realized that and very carefully removed secular officers from the senior ranks, largely through retirement. In their place, he promoted Islamists who owed their allegiance to him and would never challenge his grip on power, as long as he took care of his military allies. The recent failed coup--if it actually was a coup--illustrates how impotent secular elements in the military have become.

An equally important question: who lost the TGS?

6 posted on 04/18/2017 7:57:00 AM PDT by ExNewsExSpook
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To: Oatka

Well, I hope conservatives are out-producing leftists. But they still have the schools to convert our kids to their idiocy.


7 posted on 04/18/2017 8:00:08 AM PDT by Twotone (Truth is hate to those who hate truth.)
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To: Rummyfan

Today Turkey, tomorrow Europe.


8 posted on 04/18/2017 8:52:30 AM PDT by MeganC (Democrat by birth, Republican by default, conservative by principle.)
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To: Rummyfan
After WWI and the Armenian Massacre, the Turks did a 180 and established a Republic. The leader Ataturk brought disaffected Jewish professors from Germany just as Hitler was establishing himself. The resulting effort created great universities in Turkey and a sound modernization that lasted ... until Erdogan.

Talk about jumping back into the dark ages.

9 posted on 04/18/2017 8:58:00 AM PDT by Slyfox (Where's Reagan when we need him? Look in the mirror - the spirit of The Gipper lives within you.)
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To: Rummyfan

Trump needs to tell Erdogan (in polite, diplomatic language of course) to GTF out of Syria & northern Iraq. He’s helping nothing there (other than potentially advancing his ambition to gain new territory for Islamist Turkey) and is complicating possibilities for settlement of the conflicts.


10 posted on 04/18/2017 9:18:35 AM PDT by House Atreides (Send BOTH Hillary & Bill to prison.)
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To: Rummyfan

Now that Turkey has become a defacto dictatorship can it remain a member of NATO?


11 posted on 04/18/2017 9:41:51 AM PDT by fella ("As it was before Noah so shall it be again,")
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To: fella

The US, under Obama, was essentially a de facto dictatorship...


12 posted on 04/18/2017 10:46:00 AM PDT by afsnco (18 of 20 in AF JAG)
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To: ExNewsExSpook

Interesting tidbit - every spring, when the promotion list came out, the Turkish GO/FO would gather to discuss the names and remove any considered ‘too Islamist’. That process ceased around 2008, when Erdogan took a hard line with the military, and it’s been downhill ever since.


13 posted on 04/18/2017 2:04:36 PM PDT by GreyHoundSailor
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