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To: Lower Deck
1. The Navy retired its S-3 shipborne ASW aircraft.

2. ASW was tossed in the dumpster after the USSR fell in 1991. The Navy knows ASW is just as important as anti-mine warfare (AMW), but VF and VA admirals run the Navy and so it's CVNs all the way.

3. The P-8 replacement for the P-3 doesn't do low-level, in your face ASW. Low-level is how you localize and attack submarines. The Navy chose the P-8 737 variant to do ASW from 20,000 feet. Theory was that better sensors and faster on top speed would rule and, hey! Anyway, VP is now overland, over the horizon targeting, anyway.

4. ASW skills are highly perishable. When I was doing it in P-3s, we flew on average 100 hours per month doing it. Since 1991 it has been allowed to atrophy, with P-8 crews now doing perhaps 20 hours per month and half of that launching missiles over the horizon. Our ships -- and cities -- are going to get their asses kicked by Chinese SSKs and SSBNs at the next war. JMHO.

27 posted on 08/24/2016 8:54:18 AM PDT by pabianice (LINE)
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To: pabianice; Lower Deck; Lou L; Menehune56; PAR35

ASW is extremely unromantic. And labor intensive. And expensive. It takes a fusion of technology and tactics in this day and age, and as you said pabianice, it is a orchestra of skills, tactics, communications and deployments that have to be practiced all the time, or it doesn’t work.

In general, I believe most upper brass USN line officers understand the importance and necessity of ASW even if they don’t like it, but, like kids with a shiny toy, they are easily distracted by bigger and shinier toys. You never, ever see video or images of ships doing ASW, because...it doesn’t look like anything to an outsider. You always see them launching missiles, firing their guns, etc.

And ASW likely wasn’t viewed as being necessary “at this time” by those same people, which is a flaw. We all do it, administering to the fire that is burning our ass the hottest, but ASW needed to be maintained and it wasn’t.

And the problem is, civilians with power and purse strings need to be explained to and convinced ASW is important and necessary, or they are going to do what they want.

FWIW, I loved the S-3 from an aviation perspective. I thought it was a beautiful aircraft, made an interesting sound, and those wings seemed elegant, especially when unfolded. I have no idea how good they were from an ASW perspective, but they sure did seem like very cool planes to me. I always thought that if I could have a private plane to fly around, I wanted a C-1 Cod (Trader) or an S-3 Viking, assuming I would be taking people, luggage and equipment to places! One night in a storm, I climbed into the wheel well of one of those things and took a nap while my buddy kept a lookout. (There was no flying in that storm, so I wasn’t concerned I was going to wake up to the sound of the gear being retracted after a cat shot!) I felt like you could almost put a couch in there...


29 posted on 08/24/2016 10:06:57 AM PDT by rlmorel (Orwell described Liberals when he wrote of those who "repudiate morality while laying claim to it.")
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