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To: NorthMountain
It serves us. We do not serve it.

Recent empirical evidence suggests that this statement is false. As a normative statement, yes that how was it was designed. The United States is no longer operating according to design specifications my FRiend.

If you look at what the founders suggested in the debate that took place in the late 1780's, I think they would be appalled at the universe franchise. One man, one vote eventually gets us what we have today throughout western society -- the only permissible debate is how much of our stuff we have to surrender to a preferred political class.

You OK with millions of people voting for your rulers with no stake in the system beyond "gimme"?

51 posted on 07/20/2016 9:37:17 AM PDT by L,TOWM (There is no longer a system to work within.)
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To: L,TOWM
Recent empirical evidence suggests that this statement is false. As a normative statement, yes that how was it was designed. The United States is no longer operating according to design specifications

Yes. That's correct. And we must return it to proper operating conditions. Creating a vast horde of make-work "servants" is a further step in the wrong direction.

You OK with millions of people voting for your rulers with no stake in the system beyond "gimme"?

Ahhh, now we're gettin' somewhere. See, you posed it as a question. That, we can work with.

If you look at what the founders suggested in the debate that took place in the late 1780's, I think they would be appalled at the universe franchise.

Quite so. The franchise was limited to property owners. People could vote who materially contributed to the operation of the government, and had a tangible stake in the outcome being successful. It had nothing to do with vague notions of 'service' or 'selfishness'. It had everything to do with standing to lose if the government got out of control, and with being the people who funded the government in the first place.

As you correctly observe, we now have extended the franchise to people who stand to gain if the government gets out of control. IMO, the franchise should be strictly limited to those who pay for the government's operating expenses.

53 posted on 07/20/2016 9:47:15 AM PDT by NorthMountain (Hillary Clinton: corrupt unreliable negligent traitor)
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To: L,TOWM

“You OK with millions of people voting for your rulers with no stake in the system beyond “gimme”?”

Two wrongs don’t make a right. You can’t ‘fix’ a bad system by doubling down on statism.


64 posted on 07/20/2016 1:47:48 PM PDT by TalonDJ
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