Pope Francis calls to accept gays

Arutz Sheva ^ | 4/8/2016

[circlecity]

As usual, I don’t have a clue what any of what he’s saying means. That’s the problem with this pope. He speaks and writes in vague platitudes which ultimately say nothing. It’s like he just tosses out a Rorschach ink blot and invites everyone to ascribe whatever meaning to it they desire. I don’t consider intentional ambiguity and speaking out of both sides of your mouth to be a virtue.

[GBA]

I start with the belief that homosexuality is not the natural state of a healthy, whole, mature human, but rather a symptom, if you will, of some inner emotional/psychological injury or damage.

From this perspective, being cruel or hostile to someone who comes out as being homosexual would be wrong, just as being cruel or hostile to the victim of a car accident or to a wounded warrior or to someone suffering with pneumonia or whatever would be wrong.

In fact, from a spiritual perspective, are those "gay" souls even alive anymore or are they also lost in the valley of death, like so many of us are, and don't even know they are dead?

Spiritually speaking, these interesting times are in fact the Zombie Times of the walking dead and the spiritually dying.

Rather than castigating and berating those souls for being damaged and suffering in public, or perhaps worse, accepting and even honoring that damage as being healthy and natural while legally forcing other to do so as well, I figure it's better to heal the soul's damage and true healing for the soul comes from the Lord.

After all, the Church is not just for the healthy. The Church is for the spiritually sick and the dying souls, as well.

Rather than the "healthy" casting the first stones at those who dare be sick in their Church, we each might find that our own soul is being healed along the way when we the less traveled, healing path illuminated by His Light and marked by His bloody footsteps.

Better that path to Love and healing, than causing greater damage to one's own soul and to others by going the wide, smooth, bold and more well-traveled circular path in the valley of the dead and the dying.

[Zionist Conspirator]

And it all began by adopting a low view of the Bible in reaction to Protestantism (something no “conservative” Catholic will admit).

Because it isn't true... same with most of the things you post about the Church.

What isn't true . . . that the Catholic Church doesn't have a low view of the Bible (which it indisputably does), or that no conservative Catholic will admit it?

Are you admitting it? Because if you aren't, you have a lot of guff claiming that the Catholic Church doesn't have a low view of the Bible--especially considering the number of articles and comments your co-religionists post here attacking total Biblical inerrancy (confusing it with sola scriptura) and promoting "theistic evolution."

[Obadiah]

...implying we are the bigots.

When you distill it down, what this Pope has done, and with full intentionality, is to use the full weight of his position to affirm the Left's underlying tenant that those who do not accept sodomy or homosexuality are, in fact, bigots who need to show compassion. This is the great sin of what he has knowingly done.

It can scarcely be argued that if the Pope could have gone further in his comments he would have.

It is my belief that the Pope is being quite crafty here by subtly aligning himself with those who seek to destroy any who speak up and oppose the practice of homosexuality. I fully expect this Pope to continue his very determined effort to strip away moral tradition and replace it with moral relativism. He is well on the path to doing this.

[af_vet_1981]

I don't know.

Then learn. It is very much like the Catholic view.

We do know this, though: we know that among other sexual behaviours, Torah law expressly forbids the specific act of male homosexuality.

And we do know this: Torah law forbids bigotry; homophobia is prohibited.

And we do know this: too many Jewish girls and boys, Jewish women and men, have suffered too much for too long. And we know that most of that suffering is caused by the environment around them. We do know this: when we become judges of another person, we behave contrary to Torah law.

And we do know this: A Jew belongs in a Jewish environment. Each of us, struggling or not, needs to be in a truly Torah-observant environment. And each of us is responsible for that environment - each of us is responsible for what we bring to that environment. When we bring ignorance, or cruelty or self-righteous judgment of others, we contribute to the sullying of a true Torah environment. When we bring the most ideal principles of ahavat Yisrael, respect for every individual, recognition of each individual's personal relationship with G‑d...when we bring the best of our humanity, as expected by Torah ideals, we contribute to a Torah environment that is healthy and wholesome.

[onedoug]

Matthew 7:15-20

Neither Charles Manson nor King soebarkah have literally murdered anyone either (to my knowledge). Yet each is still culpable of that crime.

[BlackElk]

According to Thomas Reese, SJ, in today's National "Catholic" (Fishwrapper) Reporter, there is an entire chapter on the usual political bushwah of Bergoglio calling for expanded socialism et al. See ncr.com. but not too often.

Claiming that his remarks are being "twisted" is convenient. Nonetheless, he makes so many gross errors such as claiming that dealing with mythological "global climate change" is some sort of moral imperative like the necessity of expanding socialism (which has obviously been sooooo good for his native Argentina) and that borders are meaningless and we and Europe should allow our/themselves to be overrun by Islamofascist hordes bent on nothing less than killing us and wiping out Christian civilization.

Of course, while paying occasional lip service, he de-emphasizes the international plague of baby-killing, generally ignores the martyrdom of Catholics and other Christians by the Islamos, cuddles up to the sexually perverted and persistent fornicators and adulterers and those engaged in what the Church has always called intrinsically disordered behavior (homosexual perversion in plain English). Under Bergoglio, actual morality is no big deal but progressive nonsense is tres chic.

We need a new and actually Catholic pope as soon as God can arrange it, elected by a conclave mindful of the colossal blunder of the most recent conclave that elected Bergoglio. Until then, these are the bad new days.

[pgyanke]

That isn’t a quote of mine... to whom are you responding?

[Zionist Conspirator]

And we do know this: Torah law forbids bigotry; homophobia is prohibited.

I'm surprised to see this on the Chabad web site.

"Bigotry," and certainly "homophobia," are modern concepts unknown to Torah. Just a few decades ago the concept of "homophobia" didn't exist. It was invented as a blunt object with which to bludgeon everyone opposed to homosexuality.

At any rate, as I pointed out, we all have an evil inclination. Some people's includes "same sex attraction." But prior to the present "gay rights movement" the idea of prejudice against homosexuals was not considered a problem by anyone.

Exactly why are you posting this to me? Because I said that "same sex unions" as a substitute for "homosexual marriage" was not acceptable?

PS: Male homosexual acts are chayyav mitah (capital offenses). I doubt that even the most liberal Orthodox Jew considers "homophobia" on the same level.

[KC_Lion]

Ping!

[NKP_Vet]

The socialist Bernie Sanders has been invited to meet with his favorite socialist Francis. Francis so far has invited no other candidate running for US president to meet with him, only a fellow socialist. Sanders is also an atheist.

[BlackElk]

Manson is certainly convicted of nuerous murders if by nothing more direct than "conspiracy." Clearly he was the ring leader and ought to have been executed for the Tate/LaBianca murders and others at the Spahn ranch.

I can easily imagine Obozo being in an analogous position. And Hillary for Benghazi, inter alia. And Slick Willie for Vince Foster, Ron Brown and many, many others.

Being a damn fool about homosexual perversion of others does not quite make one personally a homosexual in the same way as gravely disappointing as such brainless gushy progressivism is in one with the responsibilities of the papacy. We survived Alexander VI and many other miscreants in that office. We will survive the willful progressive stupidity of Bergoglio.

[pgyanke]

What isn't true . . . that the Catholic Church doesn't have a low view of the Bible (which it indisputably does), or that no conservative Catholic will admit it?

You are wrong in the Church's view of the Bible. If you truly care, you can learn more here: Catechism of the Catholic Church.

you have a lot of guff claiming that the Catholic Church doesn't have a low view of the Bible--especially considering the number of articles and comments your co-religionists post here attacking total Biblical inerrancy (confusing it with sola scriptura) and promoting "theistic evolution."

Perhaps you are better read on FR... but I have seen no such articles attacking the inerrancy of Scripture. Rather, I have seen many articles explaining what is misunderstood about Scripture. If you have interpreted such articles another way, it could be because of your own bias.

[ladyjane]

LOL - so funny. I was responding to a post above yours.

[pgyanke]

Not terribly funny from my perspective... you have put words into my mouth that I didn’t say.

[4yearlurker]

Hey Pope...get out the Vatican Bible...open at page one.

[Genoa]

Acceptance is a difficult topic that can be easily twisted. I am in a non-Catholic church, very conservative, but our pastor teaches that we accept sinners mess and all, then help them sort it out. But that’s not accepting the sinful behavior.

[af_vet_1981]

Exactly why are you posting this to me?

You attacked the Catholic position, which can be summarized as "Every person, regardless of sexual orientation, ought to be respected in his or her dignity and treated with consideration."

I tested whether you would attack the similar Jewish position as well. Both positions agree homosexual sexual behavior is sin; the Catholic view is not a low view of the Bible when compared with Orthodox Judaism; Male or female homosexual behavior is a mortal sin, which the Catholic position upholds from the Bible, hardly a low view.

[thirst4truth]

Its about money. If they are harsh to homosexuals they may take a hit in donations from the bleeding heart liberals that fill the pews in the Catholic churches.

They send invoices for their parishioner tithe's for God's sake.

[jacknhoo]

I don’t see any confusion:

“”The pope also made some nods towards regular marriage in the paper, saying, “in order to avoid all misunderstanding, I would point out that in no way must the Church desist from proposing the full idea of marriage.”

A “great variety of family situations...can offer a certain stability, but de facto or same-sex unions, for example, may not simply be equated with marriage,” he added.

He likewise rejected birth control, opposing “safe sex” which by its wording suggests that “an eventual child were an enemy to be protected against.”

At the same time, he writes, “there is no stereotype of the ideal family, but rather a challenging mosaic made up of many different realities, with all their joys, hopes and problems.””