Posted on 04/08/2016 4:25:28 AM PDT by DeathBeforeDishonor1
Fair enough! God bless you and yours!
Don’t forget The Joy of Fornication and The Joy of Adultery and the Joy of Bestiality (can we turn away those who were just born to be “animal lovers” or even worse be “judgmental” towards them?) and some even more obscene alleged “joys.”
This pope is thoroughly modern in his beliefs. There is no black and white, only gray. Well, Christ didn’t have any problem with black and white lines. How is someone supposed to repent and be reconciled to God if there are no black and white lines???
Here is an example of how St. Paul dealt with immorality in the church ---- taken from 1 Cor. 5:5,13
It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that even pagans do not tolerate: A man is sleeping with his father’s wife. And you are proud! Shouldn’t you rather have gone into mourning and have put out of your fellowship the man who has been doing this? For my part, even though I am not physically present, I am with you in spirit. As one who is present with you in this way, I have already passed judgment in the name of our Lord Jesus on the one who has been doing this. So when you are assembled and I am with you in spirit, and the power of our Lord Jesus is present, hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord. Your boasting is not good. Don’t you know that a little yeast leavens the whole batch of dough? Get rid of the old yeast, so that you may be a new unleavened batch—as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. Therefore let us keep the Festival, not with the old bread leavened with malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people. What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked person from among you.”
Christ would welcome sinners in the sense that He would talk with them, tell them their sins, and ask them to repent. He did NOT select unrepentant homosexuals, fornicators, and adulterers as apostles, and there is zero evidence in scripture that it’s OK to allow UNREPENTANT sinners to be members of the church. In fact, there is only one Church, and it allows no unrepentant sinners at all—as in ZERO.
I mostly agree with your post, except on not embracing those who are open about being gay/perverted.
I am from time to time strongly tempted toward adultery. I don't fantasize about women other than my (first and only) wife, and I don't flirt with other women. But opportunities come up - usually to my shocked surprise, since I almost never realize what's coming in those situations. So far, I have as politely but firmly as possible rejected every such opportunity, but I have also been tempted. Very tempted some times. The Church should embrace me - but also frequently, emphatically, and unambiguously reinforce the message that adultery is completely forbidden.
The Church should respond to homosexuality the same. So long as welcoming gays and other perverts includes a frequent and clear emphasis on the relevant scriptures and their proper interpretation (which is that homosexual conduct of all kinds is always wrong), they can be welcomed without harming the Church.
The problem comes when we try to be welcoming by skipping over the parts of God's word that those in need of spiritual guidance don't want to hear. The problem comes when we accept the far left premise that quoting God's word is "hate" and encouraging/celebrating disordered conduct that violates God's word and spreads deadly diseases is "love". A Church cannot accept that premise and still remain Christian.
Any gay or single mother or father is welcome in the Church. Always have been. There is nothing at all mutually exclusive about being a single parent and practicing Catholicism. This categorizing is putridly patronizing and obnoxious
Living together heterosexuals. No. No one in their right mind is going to pretend that couples living together are not having out of marriage sex. Do forget it
Gays can be and are celibate just as easily as a single mother can be. The church doesn’t judge this. The people in the church don’t judge this xnd those who do do do out of bigotry. No being told what to think by the pope is going to change thst
Seems like the church is becoming more politically correct and less moral.
Most gays are not married - most have relationships for short times. One study showed gay man can have up to 60 partners per year. I don’t think many of these go to church.
I never understood religious gays, or pro-abortion Catholics. Bringing gays more into the flock is just another step towards a PC and meaningless church.
Our local Catholic newspaper just ran a story with a bunch of very discouraging statistics.
The Church locally has imploded in the last 15 years. Parish membership, Mass attendance, financial contributions, baptisms, confirmations, numbers of Priests.....all down by massive double-digit numbers.
Frankly I know a lot of this is due to Catholics who have gotten divorced (many times due to no fault of their own) and then felt unwelcome, or just did not want to put themselves through the hassle of an annulment. The bulk of them seem to join non-denominational churches.
I would like to think that compassion is driving this, but frankly it’s economics.
Bump for later
My impression is that we have no evidence whether the woman caught in adultery sincerely repented before Jesus talked with her. You could infer that Jesus knew more than the writers saw and wrote, but you could just as easily infer that Jesus forgave her specifically to motivate her to reform. Perhaps what the gay mafia needs most is to be welcomed into a church that recognizes them for who they are and then works lovingly (not the fake "love" of blanket acceptance but the true tough love of following God's inerrant word) to bring them to God.
The pastor who brings his (married) girlfriend to his services - yes, that was my minister many years ago, until he was removed from the position - has no business leading a church. The open homosexual who openly celebrates the claim that "love is love" is harmful to the church unless every such comment generates a scripture-based response. The businessman who brags about using payoffs to get government contracts but then donates generously to the church is a thief and not someone to celebrate for his generosity. I have had exactly those people and many others of concern in the church I attend. Sometimes the church is able to bring them back to God's word. Sometimes we fail, but it is worth trying, so long as we do not allow their presence to harm others.
Increasingly I am being led to wonder whether anyone in the Vatican has even read the letters of St. Paul.
With every passing day, the culture give men fresh reasons not to get married.
Is it economics (for their money) or is it pastoral (for access to save their souls)? I hope the pastoral consideration is the deciding factor even if the economic interest coincides with that pastoral interest.
That is both shocking and sad. I would hope that the Church would use that difficult situation as a learning opportunity to point out that life for a single parent and for the children is unnecessarily difficult. God had a reason for creating and mandating marriage.
We are all sinners saved by grace. Christians are called to love sinners, just as Christ did. "While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us" -Romans 5:8.
Just as Christians are anointed by the Holy Spirit to love sinners they are also anointed to hate and shun sin. This doesn't mean Christians are saved by their works or that Christians never sin. It does mean that Christians recognize their sin and repent.
Neither Christians or Christ -- embrace, condone or empower sin!
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