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Like the Blind Leading the Blind: Donald Trump and Evangelicals
https://ptelliott.wordpress.com/2016/01/27/like-the-blind-leading-the-blind-donald-trump-and-evangelicals/ ^ | January 27, 2016 | Peter T. Elliott

Posted on 02/24/2016 7:17:27 AM PST by TurkeyLurkey

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To: Theophilus

If you are trusting in Jesus, then you are not a Dominionist. Dominionists believe that only through their WORKS can the earth be prepared for Jesus to return. They have to create the Kingdom of Heaven before He can return. That is why it is a heresy.


61 posted on 02/24/2016 9:44:02 AM PST by SubMareener (Save us from Quarterly Freepathons! Become a MONTHLY DONOR!)
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To: TurkeyLurkey
American Evangelicals, by voting for Trump, are rejecting a key principle from the message of Christ and his incarnation: personal power is not to be prized

Render unto Caesar what belongs to Caesar. My Kingdom is not of this world.

Jesus does not give electoral advice. Jesus is interested in YOU and you are accountable to Him for the way YOU live, He does not appear to be very interested in your judgments about others.

62 posted on 02/24/2016 9:48:29 AM PST by Jim Noble (Diseases desperate grown, are by desperate appliance relieved, or not at all)
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To: inpajamas

Guarantee that about Hillary if she steals the election.


63 posted on 02/24/2016 10:02:08 AM PST by Old Yeller (Calling Obama a POS is a major insult to S.)
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To: Jim Noble

No, Jim, it was that very faulty form of pietism you seem to be recommending that led to American Christians having a greatly reduced role in American government. So much so that Falwell et al came back with the Moral Majority to try and reverse the damage done.

But if you go back to the Reformers, there was no shortage of good, godly men and women willing to step up and get involved in civil policy, allowing their faith to inform all their thinking for the whole of real life, not just in some safe little Sunday School sandbox. Nor would they have tolerated the isolation of the Christian community into a kind of ghetto just begging the secular powers for permission to exist.

Indeed, Calvin had worked out an entire theory of “vocation,” systematic Christian involvement in life and culture, followed up by other great thinkers like Abraham Kuyper, who helped us think deeply about the two spheres of human authority, civil and ecclesiastical, and how they might be harmonized. Christians are to be salt and light in a wicked world. Our first mission is the preaching of the Gospel. But the Gospel has consequences to the culture and the body politic when it is adopted on a large scale.

And so we do render unto Caesar, but given the chance to elect who Caesar shall be, we should not choose a Caesar who is oblivious to his own lack of deity. It’s not just bad for Christians. It’s bad for everybody. If we are given, in our participatory form of government, a way to stop that bad thing from happening, why wouldn’t we do it?

Peace,

SR


64 posted on 02/24/2016 10:41:36 AM PST by Springfield Reformer (Winston Churchill: No Peace Till Victory!)
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To: SubMareener
I'll stick with my Samson over some false prophet of Dominionism.

Trump is never going to call on the Lord, like Samson, either publicly or privately. Samson was raised as a sanctified nazerite not as a hedonist.

And even if Trump was Samson like: I wouldn't wish Samson on Samson.

Judges 16:30
And Samson said, Let me die with the Philistines. And he bowed himself with all his might; and the house fell upon the lords, and upon all the people that were therein. So the dead which he slew at his death were more than they which he slew in his life.

65 posted on 02/24/2016 10:43:50 AM PST by Theophilus (Make America Hope for Great Change Again)
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To: SubMareener; Theophilus
If you are trusting in Jesus, then you are not a Dominionist. Dominionists believe that only through their WORKS can the earth be prepared for Jesus to return. They have to create the Kingdom of Heaven before He can return. That is why it is a heresy.

Interesting analysis. Put it to the test with Rafael Cruz. How do you know he is not trusting Jesus? He claims to be born again, which by definition is a claim that he trusts in Jesus and in him only, not works, for salvation. At least that's what it means in evangelical circles. Do you have facts to back up your claim that Rafael Cruz does not trust Jesus?

Peace,

SR

66 posted on 02/24/2016 10:46:02 AM PST by Springfield Reformer (Winston Churchill: No Peace Till Victory!)
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To: Theophilus

I’ve done my Watchman duty with you. If you want to keep telling YHWH what He can or can’t do, and continue to judge the hearts of your fellow men, then your blood will not be on my hands.


67 posted on 02/24/2016 10:52:38 AM PST by SubMareener (Save us from Quarterly Freepathons! Become a MONTHLY DONOR!)
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To: Springfield Reformer

Listen to his sermon, and he will tell you what he believes. You don’t have to speculate.


68 posted on 02/24/2016 10:54:29 AM PST by SubMareener (Save us from Quarterly Freepathons! Become a MONTHLY DONOR!)
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To: SubMareener
Luke 6:44
For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.
69 posted on 02/24/2016 10:57:55 AM PST by Theophilus (Make America Hope for Great Change Again)
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To: EveningStar; SubMareener
As for Donald Trump, I view him as a type of Samson

Have not sen The List recently. Is Samson on it?

70 posted on 02/24/2016 11:07:15 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory. And He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the Name of the Lord forever!)
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To: jimbo807
Peddle the theocracy next election cycle. No one is buying the BS this time round.

Red herring. Nothing in the article has anything to do with "theocracy." Rather it has to do with the virtue that our Founders expected that both the people and the leaders they selected would posses.

Trump is weighed in the balances and found wanting.

I have seen many acknowledge that Trump is very virtue deficient and proclaim it to be of no consequence.

"Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone, which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free Constitution is pure virtue, and if this cannot be inspired into our People in a greater Measure than they have it now, they may change their rulers and the forms of government, but they will not obtain a lasting liberty."

John Adams

71 posted on 02/24/2016 11:29:18 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory. And He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the Name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

Blah, blah, blah.

Burn it down.

Go Trump.


72 posted on 02/24/2016 11:30:27 AM PST by jimbo807
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To: Sam Gamgee
Indeed. Take Trump's latter day conversion to pro-life with a grain of salt.

Troubling thing about his conversion is that, from his own words, it seems more utilitarian and pragmatic than truly heart felt.

When the Daily Caller's Jamie Weinstein asked Trump if he would have become pro-life if that child had been a loser instead of a "total superstar," Trump replied: "Probably not, but I've never thought of it.

The "never thought about it" is just as damning as the aborting of the "loser" child.

73 posted on 02/24/2016 11:35:40 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory. And He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the Name of the Lord forever!)
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To: jimbo807

So you are on record as being a French Revolutionary?


74 posted on 02/24/2016 11:39:59 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory. And He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the Name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

Oui.


75 posted on 02/24/2016 11:41:10 AM PST by jimbo807
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To: don-o; SubMareener
Have not sen The List recently. Is Samson on it?

Yes.


This is an ongoing list of historical, popular, and Biblical people, as well as fictional characters and animals, that Donald Trump has been compared to on FR:

76 posted on 02/24/2016 11:55:06 AM PST by EveningStar (It's a cult.)
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To: Steve_Seattle

“I wonder how many FR people - who were appalled when Obama told his supporters to “get in the face” of opponents - are now applauding Trump when he says he would like to punch a heckler? Probably quite a few.”

Can you not see the difference between the two scenarios you describe?

One is a private rally bought and paid for by Trump, the attendees of which are his guests. If someone mouths off at a party of yours are not entitled to bust them in the mouth?

The Obama scenario is someone coming to your front door or stopping you in public to “get in your face”.

The two are not comparable.


77 posted on 02/24/2016 12:02:47 PM PST by Rebelbase (Best election ever. Sick of it already, but best election ever.)
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To: Steve_Seattle

Edit: “If someone mouths off at a party of yours are YOU not entitled to bust them in the mouth?”


78 posted on 02/24/2016 12:03:59 PM PST by Rebelbase (Best election ever. Sick of it already, but best election ever.)
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To: Sam Gamgee
Take Trump's latter day conversion to pro-life with a grain of salt. 60 year old men don't suddenly have change of hearts like that.

How pitiful for you to disbelieve that such a thing is possible. I became a born-again conservative at age 50, even though I was raised Methodist and believed I was a Christian. After my political conversion came my surrender to Christ, even though I had been baptized and confirmed half a century earlier. God is good, and He is in charge.

79 posted on 02/24/2016 12:41:00 PM PST by Albion Wilde (Who can actually defeat the Democrats in 2016? -- the most important thing about all candidates.)
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To: SubMareener; Springfield Reformer
Listen to his sermon, and he will tell you what he believes. You don't have to speculate.

I've listened to part of it. I don't like it:

Larry Huch: "...We will become so blessed that we will usher in the coming of the Messiah."

Is seems to me that the coming of the Messaih shall be heralded this way:

Luke 21
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.

I believe Rafael Cruz loves the Lord and I'd love to ask him lo que da???. Anyway, having voiced my misgivings, I don't want to be a part of making a heathen like Trump a herald of the Messiah. I have no misgivings about that.

I'm going to watch/listen/comment on the rest of this, painful though it may be. Thanks SubMareener.

80 posted on 02/24/2016 12:49:58 PM PST by Theophilus (Make America Hope for Great Change Again)
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