Convection is different. It is one of the two types of heat transfer that bypass CO2 (the other is latent heat transfer). It doesn't matter what level of CO2 there is, convection and latent transfer are independent. But radiative transfer is photons emitted from the surface and lower levels of the atmosphere and all* those photons are intercepted by CO2 (* a trivial number make it through without being intercepted)
IF there were a thick blanket of CO2 preventing heat from going past the CO2
With PV=nRT and R of 0.287, T of 300K, V of 1 liter, and P of 1 atmosphere; there are 0.01 moles of air in that liter or 6 x 10^21 molecules. Since 0.04% of those molecules are CO2, there are 10^18 CO2 molecules of CO2 in just a liter of atmosphere. That's a lot of molecules and a lot of chances to intercept an IR photon. The fact that it is such a low percentage (0.04%) is mitigated by the fact that air has so many molecules.
only a few billion tons of CO2
Only a few billion? It's actually 720 billion tonnes of CO2 and even though it is spread out there are still 10^18 molecules in every liter or 10^21 in a cubic meter.
[[720 billion]]
Yep which is 0.04% of the total mass of atmosphere
[[But radiative transfer is photons emitted from the surface and lower levels of the atmosphere and all* those photons are intercepted by CO2]]
This is what I’m not understanding- the atmosphere has just 0.04% CO2 in it- all the IR photons can’t possibly be intercepted by CO2- There isn’t nearly enough CO to capture more than a scant amount- You claimed 10^41 CO2 molecules (there are 10^44 total molecules). That would indicate nearly the whole atmosphere being comprised of CO2- Science tells us just 0.04% is comprised of CO2- where are you coming up with more than 90% being CO2?
[[1) the CO2 molecules get way warmer than 102F and 2) the 0.04% also warm the other molecules by a bit as they are cooled (has to go both ways). ]]
However, there is also the law of ‘diminishing returns’- and the reason this is important is because these CO2 molecules re-absorb the same IR photons over and over and over again- The CO2 radiates it out- it’s neighbor absorbs it, it radiates it out and the original CO2 molecule reabsorbs it and so o nand so forth- until entropy causes it to fizzle out (the energy)
[[Since 0.04% of those molecules are CO2, there are 10^18 CO2 molecules of CO2 in just a liter of atmosphere. ]]
So are you saying there are 99.96% more non CO2 molecules per litre? If so this means we’re back again to massive percentage differences in CO2 and Non CO2 molecules- there just aren’t enough CO2 molecules to intercept and radiate heat or IR photons- we’re back to dumping a thimble of 102 degree water into an Olympic sized pool of 100 degree water and claiming it raised the temperature of the pool when clearly the mass volume of outside forces (the air surrounding the pool) is what regulates the temperature of the pool- The thimble, (or even 55 gallon drum if you like - not sure which one would represent 0.04% of the volume of the pool) of warmer
[[That’s a lot of molecules and a lot of chances to intercept an IR photon. The fact that it is such a low percentage (0.04%) is mitigated by the fact that air has so many molecules.]]
That can’t be- there MUST be vast swaths of atmosphere that have no CO2 molecules- an let’s not forget, even if there is a ‘blanket’ of CO2, one nano second the blanket is saturated, and in that nano second, IR photons blow right on past, so the same amount it absorbs, it also must let pass because I n that nano second, it can’t absorb another molecule- and also let’s not forget that the CO2 is reabsorbing molecules it has already absorbed, meaning new molecules go through at an even greater rate unimpeded
Let’s say there is a 1x1 foot layer of CO2- a thin layer- perhaps a molecule in thickness (I’m beign generous here by saying that the whole 1x1 foot area is covered with this layer)- now let’s assume there are, for the sake of illustration, 5 billion CO2 molecules in this layer. now let assume, for the sake of argument that 500 billion IR photons rise towards that layer and impact it all at once- the layer is going to become immediately saturated, and in that nano second, the same amount of photons that got absorbed will pass by without being absorbed because the layer is saturated, and is radiating energy out to be reabsorbed by it’s neighbor CO2 molecules etc-
Until the layer is able to ‘purge itself’ of all previously absorbed photon molecules, it won’;t be able to absorb new molecules, and so more molecules will blow on past than will ever be absorbed- it’s a numbers came it seems to me?
Note: I have no idea if any of this is even close to being correct- just trying to think through this logically, or as logically as my tired mind can muster-
You are trying to make the argument that because there is a ‘large amount’ that the exponentially larger amount of Non CO2 molecules doesn’t matter- It MUST matter-
Where is the evidence that CO2 captures all ir photons?