Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

What Hill Do We Die On, Then? (Kim Davis and Religious Liberty)
American Conservative ^ | SEpt 4, 2015 | Rod Dreher

Posted on 09/04/2015 4:15:38 PM PDT by yongin

have said these past couple of days that as gay rights and the ideology at its heart continues to conquer our culture, I expect us small-o orthodox Christians to have to take a hard, sacrificial stand against the state and society, for the sake of religious liberty. Kim Davis’s situation, I’ve said, is not the hill to die on.

The reason for this is certainly contestable, but here it is, in a nutshell.

1. Kim Davis’s position is unwinnable. Nobody seriously expects her to get gay marriage overturned, or even to succeed in carving out a special zone of protection for public officials who, for reasons of conscience, refuse to carry out lawful decisions of the courts. Even if we believe that the Obergefell decision lacks moral legitimacy, there can be no doubt that as a matter of legal procedure, the Supreme Court’s decision is the law. Our side lost that battle decisively. Kim Davis’s stance, while it may be personally courageous, is going to result in another defeat, because it cannot be otherwise in our system. The only point of backing it is to flip the bird to the state and to the broader culture — something I have great sympathy for, but it’s a pointless gesture that can only hurt us in the battles to come.

(Excerpt) Read more at theamericanconservative.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; US: Kentucky
KEYWORDS: homosexualagenda; idiotauthor; kimdavis
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 141-160161-180181-200 ... 221-224 next last
To: HiTech RedNeck

I dunno....the young today are not too swift.

They are well educated but they leaned nothing about critical thinking.

In the EU, all the government has to do is extend the hours at the pub and reduce taxes on alcohol.

In the US, Obama is doing a similar thing with marijuana.

Make them happy and they soon forget that the government reamed them from behind.

Like Net Neutrality....


161 posted on 09/04/2015 9:24:55 PM PDT by Cold Heat (For Rent....call 1-555-tagline)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 155 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

That’s exactly right.

And with the nuclear option, impeachment, added to the mix, the Congress has nearly complete power to rein in the courts, if they wanted to.


162 posted on 09/04/2015 9:25:04 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 156 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

Real pressure of some kind has a way of sharpening the thought. Even pot can’t solve, say, a starvation or a murder problem.


163 posted on 09/04/2015 9:26:28 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 161 | View Replies]

To: EternalVigilance

But they won’t....

BTW, legacy law is the body of past law used as precedent for current and future cases.


164 posted on 09/04/2015 9:27:06 PM PDT by Cold Heat (For Rent....call 1-555-tagline)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 162 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck

Well, they are all working two jobs right now...most of them cannot find work in their degree field...some are homeless that were not previously...

I suppose they might figure out who did them in, but they have not done so yet..


165 posted on 09/04/2015 9:29:16 PM PDT by Cold Heat (For Rent....call 1-555-tagline)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 163 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

Yeah.... unless some kind of breakpoint is interposed (like a new Constitution and everything rebuilt from ground up upon that) there’s going to be all these old law books hanging around.


166 posted on 09/04/2015 9:29:39 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck

If you’ve got crappy code you get rid of it. The same is true with government as with software.

Is it hard work? Sure. But in this case our survival as a free people depends upon whether that work is done.

Let me give you an example:

I worked with my state legislator to offer a bill that would ban all abortions in our state. How? One, by clearly and simply defining the unborn child as a person in the murder code. But that wasn’t enough. We had to also go through the entire Iowa Code to remove all of the code sections, mainly put there by “pro-lifers,” that acted as if the child in the womb is not a person, and therefore granted governmental license to kill them.

That’s just what you have to do if you want to restore justice in this country.


167 posted on 09/04/2015 9:30:57 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 160 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

k-12 and higher ed has taught them that the rich have stolen all the money and that all republicans are rich.


168 posted on 09/04/2015 9:31:10 PM PDT by Cold Heat (For Rent....call 1-555-tagline)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 165 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat
BTW, legacy law is the body of past law used as precedent for current and future cases.

Any positive human law or statute that violates the laws of nature and nature's God, or our Constitution, is already null and void. This is a foundational principle of western civilization, going all the way back to Hamilton, and Adams, and Burke, and Blackstone, and Aquinas, all the way to Cicero. I've already posted some of their wise words to this effect earlier in the thread.

In other words, in the legal sense, it simply does not exist.

169 posted on 09/04/2015 9:35:05 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: EternalVigilance

Something is going to have to move people to want to do that.

It’s going to have to take a public that cares. It is not reasonable to expect an elite, an officialdom, to revolutionize itself.

And the way to get it to care is to get it to care about the Lord... yeah a Crazy Evangelical like myself is going to come up with that sooner or later. And that can’t be imposed from outside. It has to be invited and be contagious.


170 posted on 09/04/2015 9:35:35 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck

We can jettison everything but the founding documents..

Legacy law can then be gradually re-considered and used if approved in the normal fashion by congress.

There will need to be several new amendments done by convention so the effect is immediate, and I would completely sack the entire education system, rebuilding from scratch..

Might take years to do it but it took 50 years to destroy it.


171 posted on 09/04/2015 9:36:12 PM PDT by Cold Heat (For Rent....call 1-555-tagline)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 166 | View Replies]

To: EternalVigilance

And fine, you can handwave as Mr. Eternal Vigilance and SAY that, but how does it go about happening in the field.

Gotta remember we are not meta-Gods.


172 posted on 09/04/2015 9:36:28 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 169 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck
It’s going to have to take a public that cares

That does not yet exist. It has to be created, nurtured, with a series of catalyst events.. Some of those events my be coming... I think we should be ready to use them advantageously when they occur.

173 posted on 09/04/2015 9:39:18 PM PDT by Cold Heat (For Rent....call 1-555-tagline)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

A complex society dependent on technological help is not going to be able to do something like that unless it wants to go back to sticks and stones. Satisfaction with 1776-era standards is pretty well kaput today.

A change in the character of the stewards is the right thing in the long run. And that can’t be forced, for we are the stewards. That has to be invited by faith into the stewards.


174 posted on 09/04/2015 9:40:29 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

I figured that was the case. But I wanted him to clarify before I answered. Thanks though.


175 posted on 09/04/2015 9:41:05 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck
Something is going to have to move people to want to do that.

The only thing that will move them is Christians getting these things right themselves, and then resolutely standing for them without compromise. Nothing less will suffice.

176 posted on 09/04/2015 9:42:42 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: Cold Heat

There are some interesting hints of this with things like the recent ascendency of Mr. Trump, who appealed to the people to stop an invasion of foreigners with unfriendly intent.

If one thinks on the physical level that is one thing. But on the spiritual level it is a problem too. Where God wanted a people whom angels help, we’ve become a people who have longed for the devil to help us.


177 posted on 09/04/2015 9:42:58 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 173 | View Replies]

To: EternalVigilance

You won’t ever get a perfect, without-compromise implementation of faith on the surface of this earth. Forget about it. Even the bible says no such thing can happen. Our destiny if saved is heaven and this is but a perfecting zone.

We might, however, get some very significant loving investment in the Lord. Perfect no; zealous towards God (for the most part) and ever-improving, hopefully.

And the results on earth might be quite a witness if that happens. This is the kind of thing that moves my heart, at least.


178 posted on 09/04/2015 9:45:25 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 176 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck
And fine, you can handwave as Mr. Eternal Vigilance and SAY that, but how does it go about happening in the field. Gotta remember we are not meta-Gods.

No, we are certainly not.

The only way to make it happen "in the field' is for conservatives to get the basics down, and for them to stop compromising those basics for any politician, ever.

Once a sufficient mass of Americans do that, and do it consistently, everything will change.

179 posted on 09/04/2015 9:46:15 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 172 | View Replies]

To: HiTech RedNeck

“Perfection” is a straw man.


180 posted on 09/04/2015 9:47:08 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 178 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 141-160161-180181-200 ... 221-224 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson