Posted on 03/23/2015 8:36:35 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
If I may-
What made the Founding generation exceptional in the regards to their particular type of naturalized citizenship wasn't that they gained it at their birth. They, of course, were already born, and that concept runs right into the provision against ex post facto laws.
No, what made it truly special (and for a limited time only) was because the country was born into them.
You probably realized that, of course..but I'm just sayin'. ;-)
well, that’s because your children were born on US territory soil (base). so they are US citizens-if they were born on german territory they would have german birth certificates— same as illegal mexicans having babies in the US- the baby will be a US born citizen,- the parents are not but the baby will be— but you became a “naturalized” citizen in 1977..kool
i don’t agree, but i do like cruz
So, what’s your point? My husband had to register both our son and daughter with the American Consulate in Munich Germany in 1963 and 1970. I was naturalized in 1977
BTTT
what i was trying to point out is cruz was born in canada and was issued a canada birth certificate.. so how can he be natural born? you are a “naturalized” citizen huh?
We were stationed there from 1972 to 1977. My husband was in Aviation and worked down at Marshal Airfield Field.
My husband was a US citizen having been born and raised in Upstate New York to US Citizen. I was a German Citizen when both our son and daughter where born in the same US Army Hospital in Germany seven years apart. It was my husband’s second tour in Germany
Of course....
Gee, my son and daughter received a German Birth certificate after they were born. My husband had to register them both in the American Consulate in Munich, at which time they received their American Birth certificate. Both received American Passports when my husband was transferred back to the States
Natural born citizens are those persons who do not require individual naturalization. There is also “Collective Naturalization.” Whenever the United States added new territories we created new natural born citizens by law and by treaty who were collectively naturalized.
Article Six Paragraph 2 of the Constitution says “This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the SUPREME LAW OF THE LAND; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding.”
The Framers established the Constitution as the highest and final authority and the Constitution was written by men.
Its ironic then that “The Father of the Constitution” James Madison accepted French Citizenship and could have voted in French elections.
“The Writings of James Madison 1790-1802”
https://books.google.com/books?id=BX3GAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA125&lpg=PA125&dq=james+madison+accepts+french+citizenship&source=bl&ots=iCEOOI-eaD&sig=-DelpRxq32kvrgBKeyeCTgNfN8I&hl=en&sa=X&ei=uNUQVbm-JMbpoASxsIGABg&ved=0CBIQ6AEwAg%23v=onepage&q=james%20madison%20accepts%20french%20citizenship&f=false/#v=snippet&q=james%20madison%20accepts%20french%20citizenship&f=false
See Post 310- I have a question that you might could answer.. She had 2 children born in a US Army Hospital in Germany, but she said they received German Birth certificates.. I thought US bases were considered US soil, and the children would receive a US Birth certificate at time of birth.. So why would they recieve a German BC? The reason i’m asking is because the John McCain issue came up in 08 about him being born on a US base in Panama making him a US citizen.. thx
“My son and my daughter where both born in Germany in US military hospital which made them both natural born US citizen because the hospital was US territory”
Your comment is false, because a U.S. military hospital in Germany is not “US territory” and certainly did not make “them both natural born US citizen” at all. They were U.S. citizens at birth because of their blood relationship to their U.S. citizen father under the authority of a U.S. Federal law, which makes them unnatural born citizens by manmade law. See the applicable U.S. law:
U.S. Department of State Foreign Affairs Manual Volume 7
Consular Affairs. 7 FAM 1100 ACQUISITION AND RETENTION OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP AND NATIONALITY. 7 FAM 1110 ACQUISITION OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP BY BIRTH IN THE UNITED STATES...7 FAM 1112 WHAT IS BIRTH “IN THE UNITED STATES”?...7 FAM 1113 NOT INCLUDED IN THE MEANING OF “IN THE UNITED STATES”...c. Birth on U.S. Military Base Outside of the United States or Birth on U.S. Embassy or Consulate Premises Abroad:
(1) Despite widespread popular belief, U.S. military installations abroad and U.S. diplomatic or consular facilities abroad are not part of the United States within the meaning of the 14th Amendment. A child born on the premises of such a facility is not born in the United States and does not acquire U.S. citizenship by reason of birth.
“You are wrong that both parents have to be US Citizen. My son was born in 1963 and my daughter in 1970. Both were born in the same hospital but in both times my husband’s duty stations were different.”
Under the applicable law at the time, your U.S. citizen husband qualified his children to choose whether or not to adopt a naturalized U.S. citizenship at birth in addition to any German or other foreign citizenship which foreign laws may have obligated or entitled them to claim before or after reaching the age of majority. The fact that you were not a U.S. citizen at the time of your children’s births and their birth on foreign soil subject to a foreign jurisdiction disqualified them from being natural born citizens of the United States of America. A natural born U.S. citizen has no other foreign citizenship or foreign jurisdiction at birth which they can choose to adopt in preference or addition to U.S. citizenship.
“Its ironic then that “The Father of the Constitution” James Madison accepted French Citizenship and could have voted in French elections.”
The French bestowed honorary French citizenship upon a number of notable U.S. citizens. Honorary citizenship is not de jure citizenship and does not make the honoree subject to any obligation of allegiance or obedience to a foreign sovereign or foreign laws and their jurisdiction. So, such cases of honorary citizenship has no bearing whatsoever upon the obligations of U.S. citizenship or the natural born citizen clause of the Constitution of the United States of America. Sometime ago on a previous FR post, I cited the French law that was explicit in describing how honorary citizenship was not actual French citizenship with all of its burdens of allegiance and obligations to French law.
“I thought US bases were considered US soil, and the children would receive a US Birth certificate at time of birth..”
You thought wrong. See the U.S. State Department commentary about the applicable law:
U.S. Department of State Foreign Affairs Manual Volume 7 Consular Affairs. 7 FAM 1100 ACQUISITION AND RETENTION OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP AND NATIONALITY. 7 FAM 1110 ACQUISITION OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP BY BIRTH IN THE UNITED STATES...7 FAM 1112 WHAT IS BIRTH “IN THE UNITED STATES”?...7 FAM 1113 NOT INCLUDED IN THE MEANING OF “IN THE UNITED STATES”...c. Birth on U.S. Military Base Outside of the United States or Birth on U.S. Embassy or Consulate Premises Abroad:
(1) Despite widespread popular belief, U.S. military installations abroad and U.S. diplomatic or consular facilities abroad are not part of the United States within the meaning of the 14th Amendment. A child born on the premises of such a facility is not born in the United States and does not acquire U.S. citizenship by reason of birth.
“The reason i’m asking is because the John McCain issue came up in 08 about him being born on a US base in Panama making him a US citizen.. thx”
John McCain’s situation was a special case due to the changing laws regarding the Panama Canal Zone and his U.S. father’s naval service. Nonetheless, John McCain was born with U.S. citizenship at birth due to naturalization at birth by U.S. Federal law regarding the child of a U.S. citizen born abroad in the Panama Canal Zone. The fact that unnatural law was required for John McCain to acquire U.S. citizenship demonstrates by definition that he was an unnatural born citizen and not a natural born citizen; despite recent political representations to the contrary.
I actually watched one of their meetings on TV a year or so back. I enjoyed it immensely. The liberals were just beside themselves. I can’t even remember much about the issues now.
The one that I do remember involved omitting all of our early history regarding founding etc. All that old stuff that happened in the past. Their excuse was that it was boring, and kids needed to understand modern day stuff, and things that were relevant today.
Bogus arguments signifying very little brains between their ears.
Natural born citizens are those persons who do not require individual naturalization.”
No, that is a false definition, because some persons acquire U.S. citizenship by operation of unnatural Federal law granting a naturalized at birth U.S. citizenship to a child who also acquired a right and/or obligation to acquire foreign citizenship along with the burdens of allegiance to a foreign sovereign and foreign laws.
WHATS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE BUSH’S CONSERVATISM AND CRUZ CONSERVATISM?........”kinder, gentler - Bush1, compassionate - Bush2 .....versus COURAGEOUS CONSERVATISM - CRUZ.
“How can anyone believe that might apply to Senator Ted Cruz, who has lived in the United States continuously since age 4?”
No one is arguing Ted Cruz did not acquire U.S. citizenship, either at birth or sometime after birth upon claiming the birthright to U.S. citizenship at a U.S. Consulate in Canada. Ted Cruz most certainly did acquire U.S. citizenship, but that U.S. citizenship was acquired by the unnatural U.S. statutory law after Ted Cruz acquired Canadian citizenship at birth and an additional right to acquire Cuban citizenship as a birthright. A natural born citizen by definition is a person who by the Law of Nature can only be born as a citizen with allegiance to only one sovereign and one native jurisdiction. By definition any person who is born with a foreign parent and/or otherwise subject to the jurisdiction of a foreign sovereign because of the place of birth or citizenship of a parent cannot possibly be a natural born U.S. citizen.
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