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To: lacrew
“Are you kidding me? This thread is about a 270 km range test. Your link points out that on 3-4 mile trips you get lousy mileage. Swing and a miss.”

The link states a typical gasoline car gets a 12% reduction in cold weather for city driving and up to 22% reduction for 3-4 mile trips. While not exactly apples to apples, I provided this simply in response to your statement, “Last I checked, my gas car gets a 0% reduction in range in cold weather.”

“Really? Then exactly what is the manual saying when it states...”

Again, that statement you are referencing is under the section titled: “Driving for Better Energy Efficiency — Use the following tips to help maximize energy efficiency and range.

These are tips for increasing efficiency, not requirements. Your original statement could have given people the impression that their Volt battery might be in danger if they did not leave it plugged in while in the sun. You said, “I know for example that a Volt owner manual states not to leave the car out in the sun without being plugged in....energy is needed to cool the batteries.”

The reality is that the battery keeps itself cool in the sun whether or not you plug it in, it just drains the battery a little in order to do it if you are not plugged in. The only concern is not leaving it out in the sun for long term storage. Now that that is cleared up, moving on.

“Anyway, I think it would be just swell if that sort of ‘common knowledge’ could be demonstrated fact before we the sheeple subsidize these schemes.”

From a USA Today article from last year:

AAA conducted a simulation to measure the driving range of three fully-electric vehicles – a 2013 Nissan Leaf, a 2012 Mitsubishi iMIEV and a 2014 Ford Focus Electric Vehicle – in cold, moderate and hot weather.

...

The average electric vehicle battery range for each full charge in AAA’s test was 105 miles at 75 degrees Fahrenheit. That dropped 57% to 43 miles when the temperature was held steady at 20 degrees. Warm temperatures were not as stressful but still delivered a lower average of 69 miles per full charge at 95 degrees, AAA said.

The 2013 Nissan Leaf, 2012 Mitsubishi iMIEV, and 2014 Ford Focus EV have EPA rated ranges of 75 miles, 62 miles, and 76 miles, respectively. This averages out to 71 miles. So in short, using the maximum rated range that AAA found under optimal temperatures as a baseline (75 deg F), the EPA rated range is 32% below max, cold weather is 57% below max, and warm weather was 34% below max (or 3% below EPA rating).

43 posted on 03/02/2015 9:33:26 AM PST by LogicDesigner
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To: LogicDesigner

I hope you understand how the cold weather mileage statement is propaganda. It is predicated on an un-garaged car, with poorly managed tire pressure and an absolute need to use seat heaters...and a need to drive only 3-4 miles. Its a stat massaged the way only government can (its a dotgov site). Perhaps its not 0%, because for around 45 seconds some of the sensors are in closed loop mode...but its very close to zero. Think about it - does your car get noticeably worse mileage in cold weather - you know, in the real world? Odds are it doesn’t. My office mate has kept ridiculously precise records on his car’s mileage for three years now...uses the same pump every time...records mileage and gas bought every time. No noticeable reduction of mileage in the winter - and his car isn’t even garaged.

Now lets look at the Volt. I’m not sure why it matters what section my manual quote comes from. Does the heading of the section change the meaning of the instructions?

I stated:

“I know for example that a Volt owner manual states not to leave the car out in the sun without being plugged in....energy is needed to cool the batteries.”

And you argued with it. So I found the exact language from the manual that states the same thing....and all you care about is the heading of the section?

Beyond that, I think you mis-understand the Volt’s “High Voltage Battery Cooling/Heating System”...and you presume it kicks on with the car off, and not plugged in to a charger. This is a contradiction to GM’s website, which states it “can be activated when the vehicle is “On” and if necessary during charging operations”. http://gm-volt.com/2010/12/09/the-chevrolet-volt-coolingheating-systems-explained/

IOW, if you don’t want to damage a battery by drawing current from it when too hot - do as the manual says and plug it in while in direct sunlight. Do you believe that now?

As far as the USA Today article is concerned - 95 degrees in southern California is NOT hot weather. I know my car can get around just fine in 110+ degree weather, because it has to do just that every year. These studies do absolutely nothing to indicate whether or not an EV could, without severe range degradation and/or battery damage. Very typical for an EV ‘test’...avoiding a scenario that even approaches worst case.


44 posted on 03/02/2015 1:40:40 PM PST by lacrew
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