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To: rdcbn
The United States currently has a shortage of high tech, high skilled workers and the coming retirement of skilled boomers will reduce the supply by a huge margin. I don't dispute that there a lots of people out of work, but there is a definite shortage of high skilled, highly educated workers, especially in the High Tech world. Fact is, that kind of talent has always been in short supply regardless of economic conditions.

Then why aren't wages thru the roof? I work as a software developer and my wages have been stagnant for over 10 years. And I am in the 'hot' area of Java web application development.

I know you are a shill for Jeb. It's ok but I hope you are paid.

In an effort to take you seriously I will try to explain what is really happening.

Labor is one facet to an economy, it's true. The less the labor supply the higher the prevailing wage. As far as I know wages are way down for everyone.

That aside, what we are really talking about is that the USA is becoming poorer every day, year in and year out. Why? It has to do with wealth creation. There is only three ways to create wealth;mine it,make it or grow it. Well due to the gloBULList trend we have off shored a huge portion of our manufacturing sector. Thus over a third of our country's wealth and all the multiplier wealth effects are gone. There were a lot of winners and a whole bunch of losers it that game. The mining industry is under attack and the coal industry which provided Appalachians with some wealth creation is gone too.

So how do we get our wealth back? First repeal the 16th amendment, barring that cut income taxes to the bone. Incorporate a Nation Retail Sales Tax(fair tax). But that doesn't get manufacturing back. What's need are strict importation rules and a tariff which would reduce the labor advantage that the third world has over US workers. I would start with a 5% tariff and continue to escalate until we reach a trade balance with that country. Prices would increase about 5% but so what. What we have now is an idled work force anyway. The last thing we need is to import MORE unskilled workers. You say unions would benefit, well union participation rate in manufacturing is at 10% and falling fast.

As for the skilled workers when you see wages really skyrocket that is when the Universities will start to see interest in STEM programs.

In closing you solution means a quicker death of the economy and the American way of life, so no thanks.

90 posted on 02/04/2015 5:43:28 PM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va
The United States currently has a shortage of high tech, high skilled workers and the coming retirement of skilled boomers will reduce the supply by a huge margin. I don't dispute that there a lots of people out of work, but there is a definite shortage of high skilled, highly educated workers, especially in the High Tech world. Fact is, that kind of talent has always been in short supply regardless of economic conditions.
Then why aren't wages thru the roof? I work as a software developer and my wages have been stagnant for over 10 years. And I am in the ‘hot’ area of Java web application development.

I know you are a shill for Jeb. It's ok but I hope you are paid.

In an effort to take you seriously I will try to explain what is really happening.

Labor is one facet to an economy, it's true. The less the labor supply the higher the prevailing wage. As far as I know wages are way down for everyone.

That aside, what we are really talking about is that the USA is becoming poorer every day, year in and year out. Why? It has to do with wealth creation. There is only three ways to create wealth;mine it,make it or grow it. Well due to the gloBULList trend we have off shored a huge portion of our manufacturing sector. Thus over a third of our country's wealth and all the multiplier wealth effects are gone. There were a lot of winners and a whole bunch of losers it that game. The mining industry is under attack and the coal industry which provided Appalachians with some wealth creation is gone too.

So how do we get our wealth back? First repeal the 16th amendment, barring that cut income taxes to the bone. Incorporate a Nation Retail Sales Tax(fair tax). But that doesn't get manufacturing back. What's need are strict importation rules and a tariff which would reduce the labor advantage that the third world has over US workers. I would start with a 5% tariff and continue to escalate until we reach a trade balance with that country. Prices would increase about 5% but so what. What we have now is an idled work force anyway. The last thing we need is to import MORE unskilled workers. You say unions would benefit, well union participation rate in manufacturing is at 10% and falling fast.

As for the skilled workers when you see wages really skyrocket that is when the Universities will start to see interest in STEM programs.

In closing you solution means a quicker death of the economy and the American way of life, so no thanks.


I am not a shill for Jeb Bush and I do not support him for President.

I also feel your pain and am, in fact, sharing your pain and have been doing so for the last 15 years or so.

Your wages are stagnant not because of domestic job competition for American jobs here in the US by foreign high tech sweat shop labor , but because we have been sold out by our political class and moronic corporate MBA class that has pursued policies that resulted in the wholesale migration of entire American industries that we invented and the jobs associated with them to countries like China, India and Vietnam.

Your competition is some foreign sweat shop labor in a foreign country who has killed your job slot in the US and relocated your job to a foreign country.

Software development, by it's nature, is especially vulnerable to this sort of off shoring.

Our ill conceived push to off shoring has devastated American manufacturing and since talent must be proximate to manufacturing it has also devastated the network of tech support and sub contractors who keep an dynamic high tech manufacturing base moving.

The problem is not that H1-B workers are stealing jobs here, it's that American jobs are being gutted and moved to foreign countries which is destroying our entire industrial base, our high tech talent poo and thus our ability to compete with foreign competitors.

I would propose the hypothesis that retaining highly skilled foreign students educated here by granting them H1-B visas makes our already badly depleted industrial base stronger and more competitive with the foreign competition, especially if said foreign talent says here on an H1-B instead of going back home and joining the foreign competition which contributes to our brain drain.

Your concern should not be some recently graduated PhD student with H1-B killing your pay scale, it should be that same PhD student going home to Taiwan or India and helping a company there put the company you work for out of business or forcing your country to off shore your job function.

If that PhD student stays here, not only does that make the US economy stronger, by supporting our industrial base and keeping jobs here, but it keeps his income here which stimulates domestic demand for goods and services and also contributes to our government's tax revenue. He also creates jobs (or prevents the loss of existing jobs to off shoring) for other Americans so they can create domestic demand for goods and services and pay taxes as well.

In short, you are worrying about some guy depressing your wages by working here when what you should worry about is that same PhD going home and stealing your companies business to a foreign competitor and putting you out of work altogether.

FWIW, I agree 100% that we need to protect America's industrial base from what amounts to China and other developing countries predatory trade policies which amount to a high tech variation on the old fashion practice of dumping by foreign monopolies and cartels.

My son is graduating with top marks from a highly regarded STEM program and he and all of his fellow students are in hot demand with multiple job offers at very high wages due to a serious shortage of qualified entry level job candidates in their field.

I am responsible for hiring STEM employees where I work and we cannot fill all of our available positions with qualified personnel so, for us at least, there is a shortage of skilled job applicants , but we are precluded by law from hiring foreign nationals.

106 posted on 02/04/2015 6:35:19 PM PST by rdcbn
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