Posted on 03/30/2014 1:28:16 PM PDT by annalex
I was trying to be generous to the red herring that is presented.
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It may be helpful if your attacks were directed to those that attacked you.......
Apparently both our ‘names’ are factual..
I don’t feel “attacked.” Why would you think so?
~70 dead at Maidan, ~70 dead at Waco.
By order of either the president or her thighness.
Sounds comparable to me.
Did what happened in Ukraine begin as a bungled attempt to serve an arrest warrant, with media nearby so that a government agency could receive more funds for a budget that was under review? And the next step: is what happened in Ukraine somehow diminished by what happened in Waco?
Waco, Apr 20 1993.
Putin isn't anyone's idea of a nice guy, he's the same kind of murdering pragmatist that is in power in this country and who are in power in most of the EU. If you wan real murdering swine look no further than LBJ who allowed thousands of US troops to die who would have survived had there been fewer limits on bombing the North along with air and artillery support in the South. There were hordes or media liars raoming the countryside attributing the slaughter of civilians to Americans only while ignoring the routine mass murder of civilians by NVA and VC action teams and keeping them off his back was more important to LBJ than the lives of US servicemen. That's murdering swine. Anything less is just your run of the mill murdering pragamatist of the sort who run most nations.
The bottom line is that the EU changed the rules of the game and refused to let Russia outbid them in the Ukraine. Rather than matching the Russian offer they preferred to put their own swine in power the same way they put the swine they prefer in Libya and elsewhere. Putin wasn't going to let that happen, especially since staying on the sidelines could lead to another 38 day "referendum" by NATO aircraft that would have without a doubt gone after the infrastructure in the Crimea as well as elsewhere.
The primary infrastructure of international importance consists of pipelines and associated faculties. The EU would be more than happy to destroy all of that and replace it with European owned and operated pipelines and facilities then have Russia either ship gas through those lines or not with no say whatsoever over the pipelines operations and so forth.
Putin is no hero but he's no idiot, either. He took the possible bombing of infrastructure in the Crimea off the table and made it crystal clear he's going to have a say with regard to any changes in power in the Ukraine no matter what rules the EU and US apply rather than sitting on the sidelines and seeing a "Ukrainian Spring" that puts US/EU pets in power. IOW, the EU and US were doing what they've been doing since Kosovo and this time, since it was logistically possible, Putin said, "Vlad don't play that".
No one took Russia seriously when they were trying to get negotiations going as soon as the mess in the Ukraine started. Everyone figured that Putin would have to just deal with the results they dictated. Should he have done whatever evil deeds he's done in order to create the current situation? No, they're immoral and illegal. Was he dealing with people who were doing immoral and illegal things in order to recreate the Ukrainian government to suit themselves? Yes.
So, Putin the "evil swine" fought fire with fire. I don't see him as a hero for doing so but I also don't see how anyone in their right mind thought they could play the game they played in Kosovo, Libya, and Egypt, on Russia's doorstep and not have Putin resort to fighting fire with fire.
I don't know what the Ukrainians had in mind but I know what the EU/US had in mind and they thought they could call the tune and Vlad would have to dance. They were wrong. What immoral and illegal actions there have been flow directly from the EU/US deciding that the game should change from buying off Ukrainian politicians to having mass demonstrations to change the government they way they've handled things elsewhere.
I don't see any good guys in the mix who aren't Ukrainian and caught up in what the EU/US could have avoided by helping calm things down and biding their time.
Yet, you took the time and effort to scold me. I guess it's your joy in life.
BOY, do you need a life. I'm sure glad I don't know you.
TOAD: Perfect call sign for you.
I frankly don't remember, but I get my share of agitated responses to what I post.
Yes. Not only that, but also Ukraine got time to get a bit organized. Putin chickened out, for the time being. One possible factor is that Obama talked to him from Er-Riadh something about oil going at $50 a barrel. That might have gotten his attention.
Thank you. Very moving.
Momentum is not giving the other side, that is NATO and Ukraine to build up an escalated response by putting them in front of an accomplished fact of a single invasion across the Southeast. Now, NATO had time to articulate its response and it was firm. Ukrainian government looks less and less as incompetent fools. Therefore if Putin still invades, the Russian people will blame him for the consequence. And indeed — they are withdrawing today.
We know that he intended to invade because the military commentary was that the troop formation was for offense and included medical personnel. We also know that without a land bridge to Crimea the whole thing becomes a logistical nightmare for RF (Crimea imports 2/3 of its energy needs).
Show me.
I've been following NATO statements and they were nice and firm.
what Obama needed to do he apparently just did,— talk to the Saudis about undercutting the Russian oil prices.
I don’t have “Ukraine information ping”. The purpose of my ping list appears at post #1. Naturally, I did a lot of posts on Ukraine lately as it is interesting, especially from the nationalist perspective, and I read Russian; in a pinch, even Ukrainian. I signed you up and feel free to ask me to drop you if my posts no longer interest you. Thank you.
Well said. That is my thoughts also. Besides, understand that for Ukraine joining EU has the connotation of leaving the Soviet sphere, which lately has become increasingly asiatic. They see far more in EU than we do: they see the two thousand years of Christian culture, even despite the obvious decline.
As one blogger, -- Russian, I believe, -- noted: There is only one civilization in the world and Europe (and the US) have inherited it. That EU has gone all-gay makes it a sick civilization, but it is still the civilization we have, there is no other.
I can understand the American isolationists. I do not clamor for America to swing the 6th Fleet around for this. But the admiration for Putin is a huge and naive mistake.
I heard some idiots on a conservative radio show here in Redding, Ca. Saying that it was the USA instigating that revolution, that we were the cause of it. wow...how reactionary against America and totally blind of the actual facts can some conservatives be!
When Americans realize that despite what they were told in school, they do not exercise a slightest control over the politics of their country, they begin to believe in conspiracies. The result of that are theories that have no relation to reality whatsoever: Soros under every bed, the gay agenda toppling governments, etc. That we don’t live in a republic of the people is true, but it doesn’t mean the world has gone off the rails and laws of rationality don’t apply to anything.
Yes..and that story with pics will show the real mean and murderous Russia to the whole world. And Putin had those people murdered, because he is the commander of the Russian forces. That is who our wimpy president is dealing with, a cold blooded murderer willing to take the loves of freedom loving people fed up with the plunder of their gown wealth by a dumbass evil leader aligned with himself.
Thanks!
Btw-how similar are the two languages, Russian and Ukrainian?
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