Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Greece Is Burning and Nobody Cares (The market celebrates. Maybe endgame is finally coming)
Motley Fool ^ | 02/14/2012 | Alex Planes

Posted on 02/14/2012 5:56:22 AM PST by SeekAndFind

Greece is burning. Not that this is a new phenomenon. But it sounds so sinister, so ominous.

When you find out why it's burning, it becomes a tragicomedy. The Greek government -- led by unelected economist Lucas Papademos -- promises to slash the safety net of many Greek citizens for a big sack of bailout money. Ordinary Greeks, whose futures are being mortgaged, are very angry. Things burn. Then everyone goes home and waits for the money to arrive.

The process repeats with such frequency that a lengthy Wikipedia page has sprung up to catalog each outburst, hence the tragicomedy. And why shouldn't the country erupt in flames every so often? The country is a tinderbox with half its young people unemployed and 20% of the broader populace jobless.

Greece has never been much more than the first domino. One is all you need, and few of Europe's dominos are stable at the moment. How many fall, and how far the chaos spreads, is not something anyone can predict with accuracy. But this repetitive charade of punishment and protest has done nothing to steady the pieces. At some point, European leaders will have to decide whether unity is more important than stability.

Lined up and ready to fall
More important issues have been pushed to the back pages by the struggles of Greece, a small rocky nation of professional tax dodgers that contributes about as much to the global economy as the state of Maryland. Take the upcoming French elections. Nicolas Sarkozy may lose badly. With four major candidates in the running, Sarkozy is polling second, 8 percentage points behind a politician once mocked as "Mr. Pudding."

The threat is so dire that German Chancellor Angela Merkel will actively campaign for Sarkozy ahead of April's vote. This international political alliance has sparked a countermovement, with Francois Hollande -- Mr. Pudding to you -- stumping for Germany's anti-Merkel Social Democrats and lending his support to Spanish Social Democrats as well.

The Merkel-Sarkozy (or Merkozy, if you prefer) alliance has been crucial to a unified EU. Despite cultural and social differences, Merkozy have moved mountains to bring the EU closer together. Already this year, a fiscal stability treaty has been approved, further empowering Europe to directly influence its member states' economies. The French government will not ratify the treaty until after April's elections, and Hollande has gained popularity in part because he refuses to do so. If France rejects the treaty, there's little reason for other member nations to uphold it. But Merkozy's fiscal austerity has done little to fix the EU's problems, so perhaps there's little reason to continue down that road.

It's all downhill from here
This Wednesday will offer critical information on the state of the eurozone economy. Fourth-quarter economic estimates for eurozone nations will be released then, which may well corroborate earlier predictions that the region is sliding into recession. Other indicators bear out this belief. Eurozone retail sales fell during the holidays. German factory orders plummeted. EU-wide unemployment rates are testing heights not even reached during the last recession.

Country

Total Unemployment, October 2009*

Youth (16-25) Unemployment, October 2009

Total Unemployment, December 2011

Youth Unemployment, December 2011

France 8.3% 24.7% 8.2% 23.8%
Germany 7.3% 11.4% 5.2% 7.8%
United Kingdom 5.7% 19.4% 6.1% 22.3%
Spain 16.7% 39.8% 20.6% 48.7%
Italy 6.9% 27.2% 6.9% 31.0%
Portugal 9.8% 25.7% 12.0% 30.8%
Ireland 10.7% 26.5% 13.0% 29.0%
Greece 8.7% 27.4% 17.4% 47.2%
All EU 8.0% 21.1% 8.5% 22.1%

Source: Eurostat via Google Public Data. Seasonally adjusted. *October 2009 represents highest unemployment rate in the U.S. during current period.

Many Europeans may not have noticed the slide. The EU's anemic GDP growth rate collectively nudged above 1% just once in the past decade and suffered a shallower plunge by far than the United States in 2009. The EU recession has been one wrong step away for years. Now that a recession is imminent, the effect on global commerce might be more of a glancing blow than a knockout punch.

Endgame
So what comes next? The long-term consequences of a possible Sarkozy defeat are uncertain. Events in France could cascade across the continent until leaders decide to emulate the evident success of American stimulus efforts instead of tightening the austerity vice. Or little may ultimately change. Political rhetoric rarely survives whole once the heat of campaigning gives way to the reality of governance.

Whatever happens, the EU is in no shape to be the engine of future global growth. Its birth rates are too low to support population expansion. Abysmally high unemployment isn't likely to encourage immigration. The economy may face recession for a period of time or bounce back toward mediocrity. The consequences of systemic unemployment at this scale take years to fully play out.

The markets don't really care about any of that for the moment. Many Greek stocks have bounced to the moon since the start of the year, with National Bank of Greece (NYSE: NBG  ) up 94% and DryShips (Nasdaq: DRYS  ) up 58%. It may be many months before the full measure of Europe's efforts can be known, but investors can still try to make that dead cat bounce.

American markets might fall when Europe accepts its harsh reality, but probably not for too long. 1997's Asian Contagion dropped the Dow (INDEX: ^DJI  ) 1,100 points in October from highs set that summer, but new records were set by the following February. The Mexican peso crisis offered barely a speed bump. Russia's 1998 default set the Dow back all of four months before it resumed its march toward five-digit territory. If Europe had followed this familiar script, the Greek crisis would have been resolved a long time ago, quite possibly with fewer riots and less extended pain.

Granted, the eurozone has greater global economic importance than did the Asian nations, or Mexico, or Russia. Things may decline more sharply than most expect. But the eurozone has been more a rusty machine cranked by -- and feeding into -- Germany, and less a long-promised engine of continent-wide economic growth. If one of its many gears pops out, we might not notice as much as hysterical headlines might have you believe.

Today, Greece burns and the market celebrates. Maybe the endgame is finally coming. We can only hope.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: eu; euro; greece
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-45 next last

1 posted on 02/14/2012 5:56:30 AM PST by SeekAndFind
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Maybe collapse is the medicine Greece needs?


2 posted on 02/14/2012 6:01:54 AM PST by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
Ordinary Greeks, whose futures are being mortgaged, the bills for whose entitlements are now coming due, are very angry.
3 posted on 02/14/2012 6:01:59 AM PST by dirtboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Coming to a country near you.


4 posted on 02/14/2012 6:02:31 AM PST by malos (Call Me Inpressed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Coming to a country near you.


5 posted on 02/14/2012 6:02:45 AM PST by malos (Call Me Inpressed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

The liberal mainstream media is not covering the burning of Greece.Instead they cover Whitney Houston. Face it the media has been controlling the U.S.A for the last 100 years.


6 posted on 02/14/2012 6:04:05 AM PST by Democrat_media (China is destroying all our jobs and manufacturing ability. China makes everything.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

“Events in France could cascade across the continent until leaders decide to emulate the evident success of American stimulus efforts instead of tightening the austerity vice.”

Oh geez.


7 posted on 02/14/2012 6:04:45 AM PST by Rennes Templar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: dirtboy

Yeah, good correction. I really don’t have a heck of a lot of sympathy for people who thought they could live on fairy tales and other people’s money.


8 posted on 02/14/2012 6:04:56 AM PST by drbuzzard (different league)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

I’m saving the fire extinguishers for our country.

We’re going to need them around mid 2013.

The financial house of cards is about to collapse.


9 posted on 02/14/2012 6:06:43 AM PST by exit82 (Democrats are the enemies of freedom. We have ideas-the Dems only have ideology.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
Events in France could cascade across the continent until leaders decide to emulate the evident success of American stimulus efforts instead of tightening the austerity vice.

"The evident success of American stimulus?"

Just because there was a stimulus and, some three years on, there are a couple signs of recovery does not mean the stimulus caused them. Keynesians will find validation of their theories anywhere.

10 posted on 02/14/2012 6:11:39 AM PST by BfloGuy (The final outcome of the credit expansion is general impoverishment.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Obama’s Greek columns were truth in advertising!


11 posted on 02/14/2012 6:14:58 AM PST by JohnBovenmyer (Obama been Liberal. Hope Change!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

At this point everybody knows that Greece can’t and won’t repay its debts. The hand wringing is the bankers and their puppet politicians trying to figure out how best to cover those bad loans by making taxpayers and their central banks repay the banksters.

The bigger problem is that other, larger EU countries are also over indebted and similarly at risk for default, which will become obvious once the debt bubble house of cards in the western world begins its inevitable collapse.


12 posted on 02/14/2012 6:16:54 AM PST by JustTheTruth
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Interesting chart.

I suspect those statistics are every bit as bogus as the numbers the US Labor Dept. puts out every month, and that the unemployment numbers are double what the EU is admitting.

The fuse is lit and it’s only a matter of time before the whole thing goes “BOOM”!


13 posted on 02/14/2012 6:17:27 AM PST by Ernie Kaputnik ((It's a mad, mad, mad world.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: exit82

RE: I’m saving the fire extinguishers for our country.

We’re going to need them around mid 2013.

____________________________

I just cannot help but wonder why people are still willing to lend to America at less than 2% interest rate.

The 10 year yield today is just 1.99% ...

Or maybe, most of it is the Fed printing money to buy up US treasuries...


14 posted on 02/14/2012 6:20:58 AM PST by SeekAndFind
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

The fat lady has sung. Finally.


15 posted on 02/14/2012 6:26:01 AM PST by mosaicwolf (Strength and Honor)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

what? WHY WORRY!
Obama’s Plunge Protection Team will TWIST the markets with your tax money, buying stocks to prop up prices, until the election is over.


16 posted on 02/14/2012 6:29:18 AM PST by tcrlaf (Election 2012: THE RAPTURE OF THE DEMOCRATS)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
I Love this guy! Great article.

“Greece has never been much more than the first domino”

“But this repetitive charade of punishment and protest has done nothing to steady the pieces.”

“At some point, European leaders will have to decide whether unity is more important than stability.”

“Francois Hollande — Mr. Pudding to you —”

“The Merkel-Sarkozy (or Merkozy, if you prefer) alliance”

“Many Greek stocks have bounced to the moon since the start of the year, with National Bank of Greece (NYSE: NBG ) up 94% ......but investors can still try to make that dead cat bounce.”

“But the eurozone has been more a rusty machine cranked by — and feeding into — Germany, and less a long-promised engine of continent-wide economic growth. If one of its many gears pops out, we might not notice as much as hysterical headlines might have you believe.”

(me) Just rip the darn band aid off! Painful, but the healing can finally begin.

17 posted on 02/14/2012 6:31:15 AM PST by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Democrat_media

“The liberal mainstream media is not covering the burning of Greece.Instead they cover Whitney Houston. Face it the media has been controlling the U.S.A for the last 100 years.”

I can’t say I blame them in this case. It’s such a routine there. Here we have kicking and screaming in talk radio when the government does something unpopular - there they go out and burn buildings. A week later...no difference, the stuff passes...and life moves on.

It like the Ralph and Sam cartoons.


18 posted on 02/14/2012 6:31:52 AM PST by BobL (I don't care about his past - Santorum will BRING THE FIGHT to Obama)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
This is going to sound cold and harsh, because it is. The worse Greece gets the better it is for the United States. Why? Because we are going to have to do the same thing when we are unable to pay our debts. And the more fires and blood fill the TV screens from Greece the better the chance people in the US will realize that it can happen here. And if enough people come to their scenes before November we may be able to limit the burning to just the inner cities.

I no longer think it can be stopped. Obama has done too much damage. But it might be stopped short of total destruction of the nation.
19 posted on 02/14/2012 6:35:53 AM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Rennes Templar

That line also jumped out at me. How can anyone possibly term the profligate “stimulus” spending — with its paucity of positive results — as an “evident success”?


20 posted on 02/14/2012 6:56:40 AM PST by hampdenkid
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-45 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson