Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Durus
In the real world, certain firearms (such as a 105mm howitzer) by certain people (those out on bond, etc) yes. The potential destructive power of modern weapons such as a howitzer or M60 create real world problems even the most intelligent and astute founding fathers could not have foreseen

That is not unusual or restricted to firearms. For example, what constitutional guarantee do we have of freedom of the news on TV and radio. We have constitutional guarantees of freedom of Th's PRESS but t
Tv doesn't use presses..... Nor do we on FR The courts have changed the meaning of “press” to mean all media.

Regarding the “who” issues, I believe certain people, criminals included, give up certain rights (voting, firearms possession, etc) long after any jail sentence has run it's course.

I realize that is not the absolutist Position many here advocate, but it is my personal belief.

106 posted on 10/27/2011 7:26:56 AM PDT by MindBender26 (Forget AMEX. Remember your Glock 27: Never Leave Home Without It!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 103 | View Replies ]


To: MindBender26
The potential destructive power of modern weapons such as a howitzer or M60 create real world problems even the most intelligent and astute founding fathers could not have foreseen

Leftist talking point. Or are you seriously saying that the FF's, whose ships sprouted ranks of CANNONS couldn't have foreseen larger weapons? We used Coehorn mortars, 16lbs Howitzers, and a variety of other field artillery in our War for Independence. To say they couldn't have envisioned field artillery in the hands of private citizens is either a stunning display of wanton ignorance or an outright lie.

I realize that is not the absolutist Position many here advocate, but it is my personal belief.

Well, it certainly isn't a "Constitutional" or "conservative" belief... You got that part right.

107 posted on 10/27/2011 8:04:57 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 106 | View Replies ]

To: MindBender26
In the time of the founders individuals owned personal warships that far exceeded the damage capability of an M60 machine gun or a single howitzer. If you wish to change the constitution be honest enough to make the argument to change the constitution the only way it can legitimately be changed, not through judicial fiat because "the founders couldn't have foreseen blah blah blah"

The term "press" in freedom of the press was a colloquialism that described individuals that distributed the news. It included individuals that hand printed broadsheets and those that used printing presses. It does not mean a physical printing press. Nor does it only mean those that use a physical printing press. The term "press" in the constitution literally meant all known media distribution methods and it means the same thing today.

The constitution is not dependent on any ones opinion or personal belief. It means what it says and only what it says. Without the constitution as the foundation for our civil society, it is only a matter of time before we have a tyranny. The founders lived through a tyranny and fought against it. Against all odds they won. They created a government, via the constitution, that was ruled by the people. That was restrained by limited powers from imposing tyranny.

Today we have people that argue against the constitution such as yourself. I don't know what your motives are and they aren't important. I know what ignoring the constitution leads to and tyranny is a far greater evil than all the hypothetical bogey men you use to lend credence to your argument.

109 posted on 10/27/2011 8:12:22 AM PDT by Durus (You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality. Ayn Rand)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 106 | View Replies ]

To: MindBender26
-- I believe certain people, criminals included, give up certain rights (voting, firearms possession, etc) long after any jail sentence has run it's course. --

That's generally correct as a statement of the condition of the law, but not totally correct. Many states fairly easily rehabilitate convicts as to voting; and all also have means to rehabilitate as to keeping and bearing arms.

However, you, being well versed in the law (and I am too, FWIW), may know the history. The first I know of, of a felon being perpetually deprived of the right to keep and bear arms is in law less than 80 years old. From time to time, I've looked for the "longstanding" prohibition on felons who have served their time, from keeping and bearing arms. I come up blank. I believe Clayton Cramer has researched this as well.

Anyway, the modern authority for your proposition is clear enough, but I wonder if you know the history of this - or is "longstanding prohibition" another example of the courts making things up?

-- The potential destructive power of modern weapons such as a howitzer or M60 create real world problems even the most intelligent and astute founding fathers could not have foreseen --

Not so. See canon. If muzzle-loaded, still legal for unregulated private ownership. Same for sawed off shotgun, see blunderbuss.

They likely did not foresee the mayhem possibilities associated with gasoline.

112 posted on 10/27/2011 2:25:01 PM PDT by Cboldt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 106 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson