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To: Who is John Galt?

You, like every other sovereignist, refuse to answer one quesiton I’ve posed every time these discussions arise: if all states have equal rights, do states created by the federal government after the original thirteen colonies have the right to secede from the country that created them? In short is my state of Wisconsin, made a state in 1848, sovereign and does it have the right to secede?


813 posted on 04/30/2011 3:46:23 PM PDT by driftless2 (For long-term happiness, learn how to play the accordion.)
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To: driftless2

Yes, next question.


814 posted on 04/30/2011 6:29:04 PM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: driftless2
You, like every other sovereignist, refuse to answer one quesiton I’ve posed every time these discussions arise...

Actually, you're wrong. I've never refused to answer that question, whether posed by you or any other historical revisionist.

;>)

...if all states have equal rights, do states created by the federal government after the original thirteen colonies have the right to secede from the country that created them? In short is my state of Wisconsin, made a state in 1848, sovereign and does it have the right to secede?

Let's see what the State of Wisconsin had to say:

Resolved, That the [federal] government, formed by the Constitution of the United States was not the exclusive or final judge of the extent of the powers delegated to itself; but that, as in all other cases of compact among parties having no common judge, each [State as a] party has an equal right to judge for itself, as well of infractions as of the mode and measure of redress.

-Wisconsin State Legislature, March 19, 1859 [General Laws of Wisconsin, 1859, 247, 248.]

Perhaps you recognize the language (or perhaps not). In any case, the State of Wisconsin claimed the right to "judge for itself, as well of infractions as of the mode and measure of redress" - which quite obviously did not exclude the right of secession. "In short," my answer is yes - in 1859, Wisconsin had the right to secede.

Now, perhaps you would like to provide some historical documentation supporting your "contention" - that the States ratifying the new Constitution intended to prohibit "states leaving the union under any pretext."

Or, perhaps not...

;>)

815 posted on 04/30/2011 8:58:57 PM PDT by Who is John Galt? ("Sometimes I have to break the law in order to meet my management objectives." - Bill Calkins, BLM)
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To: driftless2; Who is John Galt?; central_va; Tublecane
yes, by their participation in the voluntary union, all rights delegated to to the central government are delegated by all states. likewise, all rights reserved by any state are reserved by all states as they are not delegated to the central government.

Re: Wisconsin, as a territory, they voted to apply for statehood, drafted their own sovereign state constitution, then were accepted as a state. in 1846 their constitution failed to ratify, then rev 2 was ratified in 1848 and only then were they accepted to the union.

iow, they required their own state constitution to be ratified before being admitted to the union by the other states. "the country that created them"...didn't create jack, thus the difficulty you have with your mythical question all those "sovereignists" fail to answer to your satisfaction.

tough concept, i know, but you'll get it one day.

(if you're at a loss, feel free to go with tublecane's next response..."so what?" seems to work well for him.)
816 posted on 04/30/2011 9:22:56 PM PDT by phi11yguy19
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