So are you saying what Jesus said to Mary was determined un-important by the Creator? or do you think what Jesus said to Mary, would not be understood by most people and rejected because it was to Mystical for most people to understand through-out the ages?
Or can we even know why it was rejected?
I only ask because those writings were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls when many hidden things seem to be -un-covered
and when Prophecy became apparent for our Generation with Israel once becoming a nation again...
Thanks for your replies ST! :)
See here in this Gospel to Mary, I can imagine how strange and wierd it would sound to the World through-out the ages, yet what he says to her for our Generation does not sound far-out at all..
Do you agree?
Will matter then be destroyed or not?
22) The Savior said, All nature, all formations, all creatures exist in and with one another, and they will be resolved again into their own roots.
23) For the nature of matter is resolved into the roots of its own nature alone.
24) He who has ears to hear, let him hear.
25) Peter said to him, Since you have explained everything to us, tell us this also: What is the sin of the world?
26) The Savior said There is no sin, but it is you who make sin when you do the things that are like the nature of adultery, which is called sin.
27) That is why the Good came into your midst, to the essence of every nature in order to restore it to its root.
28) Then He continued and said, That is why you become sick and die, for you are deprived of the one who can heal you.
29) He who has a mind to understand, let him understand.
30) Matter gave birth to a passion that has no equal, which proceeded from something contrary to nature. Then there arises a disturbance in its whole body.
31) That is why I said to you, Be of good courage, and if you are discouraged be encouraged in the presence of the different forms of nature.
32) He who has ears to hear, let him hear.
So are you saying what Jesus said to Mary was determined un-important by the Creator? or do you think what Jesus said to Mary, would not be understood by most people and rejected because it was to Mystical for most people to understand through-out the ages?
Whatever Jesus said at the time served the purpose for which Jesus intended it. It wasn't unimportant for the purpose that Jesus had, at that time.
I mean, you know (should be obvious) that every word that Jesus ever said in His life is not in Scripture. Were there words that Jesus said (anywhere at any time) which were unimportant? No, I doubt that Jesus was saying things that were unimportant. The question is... for what purpose were the words spoken?
Was that purpose (for which Jesus spoke "other words) -- for the people of God, in that it was something intended to be for (1) doctrine, (2) reproof, (3) correction, (4) instruction in righteousness -- so "that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work."
The answer would have to be no ...
Why would the answer have to be no? ... well..., because God tells us that what we have in Scripture is so "that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work."
If God left out something (for that purpose) then what He says couldn't be accomplished.
We do have the complete Word of God for the purpose of -- (1) doctrine, (2) reproof, (3) correction, (4) instruction in righteousness -- so "that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work."
I think what you and some others may be "dealing with here" -- is a curiosity to find out much more about what Jesus said and did and how He acted and what His interactions were with other people, more so than what we have.
However, when one "seeks to go beyond" what God has already determined that He wants you to know now (in His authoritative Word that He has given us) ... we are starting encroach very subtlely on the territory of Satan, when He fell.
I think Satan "wanted more" than what was determined for Him. Satan thought he was more than what God said he was. We are very subtlely encroaching upon that territory when we think we should "have more" than what God has already predertimined we should have.
This is the exact sort of thing that leads to cults and "special knowledge" and "in-groups" (those "in the know") -- which eventually lead down a pathway that removes one from the proper knowledge that God wants us all to have -- "for His purposes" -- that He intends for us in this world, right now.
I think at a later time, and in a manner that God has determined and willed for us -- we will know more. But, when we seek out sources that God doesn't intend and when we want to "go beyond" what God has determined -- this usually ends up "in a fall" for that person.
For example, at the time of the coming Kingdom of the Messiah on this earth, we will certainly know more than we do now, about all aspects of that Kingdom, in which we have only been given certain limited things to know about it -- at the present time. That's done by "God's specific timing" to do so -- and not by "our timing" or "desires" to know more than God has determined for us, right at the moment.
AND... one more thing ... about the "mystical" here... Note that God has "anchored His Word" -- in "reality". His Word has been tied very tightly to "actual circumstances" and "happenings" in this world, where things can be seen and proven and verified (and they have been). The very interesting thing about "God's Word" and His "plan of Salvation" for the world -- is that it's so anchored in "reality" of circumstances that actually happened to people -- that it's not subject to hoaxes and twisting out of shape (in the understanding of it). God has "woven His message" very tightly into the "reality in which we live" so that His message can't be twisted out of shape, if we understand that reality in which we live.
God has made "His message" to come from an "actually happening" that gives a "teaching" and part of "his plan" to us.
For example, the serpent in the wilderness which was "hung up" for the Israelites to see, so that when they were bitten by the serpents (and would die) -- all they had to do was glance up and look at the serpent that Moses had put up (at God's command) -- and when they looked at it -- they would not die from having been bitten.
That actually happened. It was a "reality" ... an actual circumstance in the lives of those people living then. And that became a "lesson" for understanding about Jesus hanging on the cross and the salvation that He provides for us.
BUT, when you start dealing in the "mystical" and "private knowledge" -- you'll find that this becomes "divorced from real circumstances of life around us" and it has a tendency to get all twisted out of shape.
This is the kind of messages that the demons send to us (i.e., send to mankind) -- the "mystical" -- which is divorced from reality (because the demons can't really affect reality the way God can). And thus, the demons send mankind messages through "mystical means" so to twist and subvert God's message, and get people off track from it.
I would be very careful about the "mystical" in that regard. God's Word, on the other hand, is anchored in the reality and lives of Adam and Eve, the real lives of Noah and his family during the flood, the real life of Abraham, and then Isacc and Jacob, from which came the twelve tribes of Israel. All of this was not "mystical" or "secret knowledge" or "special knowledge" but open to all. It was anchored in the real circumstances that God caused to happen in the "space-time world" that we all live in -- in order to "authenticate" His message to us. Only God has absolute control over this "space-time world" that we live in -- and so He "attaches" His message to what only He can control to verify and authenticate it as "true".
Anyone can make "mystical" -- but only God can change "reality" and make it actually "happen" and thus "weave His inerrant and infallbile and authoritative" Word into it and through it and come out with exactly what His purpose is.
I hope you see that "connection" to "reality" that God has linked His Word to -- and not the "mystical" ... :-)
Or can we even know why it was rejected?
For some writings, you can know now. One way that a prophet is discredited, from what we see from the Bible -- is -- if that prophet says one thing that is wrong, does not happen, is not true -- he is stoned and killed as a false prophet.
So, one way that the people of God judged a particular writing -- is if in that writing (let's say some "book" or "scroll") it has one thing that is wrong in it -- some false statement (or assertion or fact that it represents). The whole thing is rejected and thrown out. For example, some writing has 100 statements/assertions that it makes. You find just one of the 100 items that is wrong -- you have to reject all 100 of what it said (not just the "one item"), in that writing. That's one way we can know.
If you go into the subject of the "canon of Scriptures" you'll find a list of things that were used to "recognize" whether some was "determined by God" to be Scripture. All we do is "recognize" -- God is the one who "determines" (and "makes it so").
I only ask because those writings were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls when many hidden things seem to be -un-covered and when Prophecy became apparent for our Generation with Israel once becoming a nation again...
Well, I did show you (up above) that they weren't found with the Dead Sea Scrolls. Those documents were found in Egypt. ... :-)
Another thing to keep in mind here ... is that as we come closer to the time when the Judgement of God comes down on this earth -- we also get closer to the time of rampant deception. More things are going to happen and be discovered, during these times. Whenever God steps up His actions -- Satan ramps up his own, too ... you see ...
Keep in mind what God says about this deception and what is going to happen, and how this deception is dealt with ...
Matthew Chapter 13 24 Another parable He put forth to them, saying: "The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; 25 but while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat and went his way. 26 But when the grain had sprouted and produced a crop, then the tares also appeared. 27 So the servants of the owner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?' 28 He said to them, 'An enemy has done this.' The servants said to him, 'Do you want us then to go and gather them up?' 29 But he said, 'No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest, and at the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather together the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, but gather the wheat into my barn." ' " [ ... ] 36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away and went into the house. And His disciples came to Him, saying, "Explain to us the parable of the tares of the field." 37 He answered and said to them: "He who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. 38 The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. 39 The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels. 40 Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. 41 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, 42 and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then the righteous will shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears to hear, let him hear!
Thus, we see that Satan has sowed the "tares" (and it represents things like deception, doctrines of demons, things to take people away from the Word of God).
And how does God deal with it ... He leaves the tares in place until the time of the harvest when the angels will remove those tares, at the end of the age. We're not quite to the end of the age, yet -- but we will be soon. In the meantime, God says we will be living with the deception and the sowing of the tares, by Satan and his fallen angels.