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To: muawiyah

“I was referring to the cultural requirements ~ not the legal requirements. “

In Islamic societies - and Turkey IS an Islamic society - culture, legalities, and religion are all enmeshed and not distinguished.

“Before the Seljuks were “converted” you’d probably had have to have had become a pagan of some kind though.”

Unlike most monotheistic religions, pagans are generally pretty tolerant of other beliefs and more than willing to incorporate other people’s God’s into their own pantheon or practises if they feel they have useful powers.

“You did know the Arabs were Moslems long before the Turks,”

Yes.

“and even Greek speaking Byzantine military units converted en mass to Islam (from both Mithrist and Christian traditions).”

Perhaps, but under what circumstances? Losing their heads?

“If you want to blame someone for why the Turks are what they are I’d point first to Byzantium.”

Hardly. The Byzantines put up a truly heroic rear-guard action against Islam, blocking its expansion into Europe before the rape of Constantinople. If there is any blame to be assigned to Byzantium, it was thier intolerance of other Christian religious streams which differed from the Orthodox, and led some non-Orthodox Christian popualtions to intially welcome Islamic overlords. In time, they learned that their initial pleasure was misplaced.


18 posted on 04/08/2010 6:16:54 AM PDT by ZULU
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To: ZULU
The Turks existed long before Islam came around. In fact, one of the ruling dynasties in Northern India headquartered itself in what is now Bhutan. They produced, among others we know about, Buddha!

Later on they were driven from India and returned to Yakutia, now part of Russia. By 560 AD they were invading Korea and Japan.

There is a large Turkish element in both Korean and Japanese languages.

The Seljuks were just another bunch of Turks from the steppes and plains of Western Asia, not much different than the Yakuts. At some point they managed to encounter the dominant population of Anatolia and became a serious threat to the Middle East.

They were then "converted to Islam" by Moslem missionaries. I do believe that tamed them down a bit.

In fact, as they moved West they managed to disrupt the tourist trade Egypt maintained for Moslem and Christian visitors to Jerusalem. One thing led to another and next thing you know the French sent in an army This period is called The Crusades (just a minor historical point). The important thing was the Seljuks arrived in the Middle East anyway and started screwing up stuff right off the bat and were not beyond stepping on Moslem toes.

The Byzantine Armies the earlier Arab Moslems had encountered (in the 700s) converted because the Arabs, crafty devils that they are, PAID them ~ something Byzantium had neglected to do for over a century!

19 posted on 04/08/2010 6:29:00 AM PDT by muawiyah ("Git Out The Way")
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