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To: Seizethecarp

Rhodes Complaint P 148. “All that is asked of the President is that he humbly acknowledge and produce his true and complete original birth certificate, and that he then confirm and acknowledge that, no matter where he was born, he cannot be President because one of his parents (Obama‘s natural father) was not a US citizen at the time of his son‘s birth.”

That seems to me to be a question of law, not fact. How can Obama be forced to answer a question, when there is no court ruling that one’s parents must both be US Citizens in order to be President? (This question has never been asked or answered in the Supreme Court.)

Where’s Orly’s support for the claim in her filing/complaint? (Citatation to the Constitutional provision which so provides, case law, US Code, etc.?)

If you are asking a court to make a determination as to the legal issues involved in such a question, you can’t expect to make the Defendant admit to something where there is no legal support for the conclusion. Especially when there is no legal authority to reach the conclusion she is asking him to reach and “admit.”

If Obama is born in the US, I believe he’s a natural born US Citizen, unless he father was a diplomat and outside the scope of lawful US Jurisdiction during the time of his presence here. I have found no basis for the claim that both parents must be a US Citizen, if you are born in the US, in order to be a natural born US Citizen. (Or at least not post 14th Amendment and the US v Wong Kim Ark decision of 1898.) As just mentioned, the Ark decision found a person born, on US soil, of two non-citizens to be a US citizen at birth. (Further, neither of the parents were even capable of being US citizens as they were prohibited by Federal law at the time which discriminated against Chinese immigrants and disqualified them from naturalization)

Basically, there are only two types of US Citizens - natural born and naturalized. The 14th Amendment grants one citizenship upon birth on US soil. If born in a US state (Hawaii) or qualifying US Territory then the notion that somehow Obama isn’t qualified due to the non-citizenship of his father is very far-fetched given the SCOTUS’s decisions on citizenship in the past and the plain language of the 14th Amendment.

Besides, the fact that his father was a British subject was well known BEFORE Obama became president and if there were any substantial law which prevented him from becoming president, why did NO ONE on a national level (such as the Republican Party) challenge his placement on the ballot for that reason?

So again, basically Orly is asking Obama to “admit” something that he really can’t even admit. There is absolutely no presumption that Orly’s claims in regard to both parents needing to be US Citizens in order to be a natural born citizen are correct and she has presented nothing in her filings to support her claim.


259 posted on 09/16/2009 9:07:08 PM PDT by PaultheMan
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To: PaultheMan
Please visit Leo Donofrio’s blog:

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/

Natural born, native born and naturalized are distinct.
Only natural born can be POTUS. Natural born is not a statutory definition but a condition of birth commonly understood by the founders to mean citizenship of both soil and blood without any foreign blood. The 14th did not repeal the natural born provision and Wong only concerned citizenship on US soil, not by blood. Wong was not made a natural born citizen and eligible to be POTUS by the Wong decision.

262 posted on 09/16/2009 9:34:20 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: PaultheMan
if you are born in the US, in order to be a natural born US Citizen. (Or at least not post 14th Amendment and the US v Wong Kim Ark decision of 1898.)

The only place "natural born" appears in Wong Kim Ark is in a footnote. Wong was ruled a citizen, not a natural born citizen. That footnote makes a distinction between "child of aliens" and "natural born child of citizens", but only to say they are equally citizens.

The right of citizenship never descends in the legal sense, either by the common law or under the common naturalization acts. It is incident to birth in the country, or it is given personally by statute. The child of an alien, if born in the country, is as much a citizen as the natural born child of a citizen, and by operation of the same principle.

This was quoting "Mr. Binney, in the second edition of a paper on the Alienigenae of the United States, printed in pamphlet at Philadelphia, with a preface bearing his signature and the date of December 1, 1853".

The fourteenth amendment did not change the definition of natural born, it did make citizens of all born in the United States, similar to statutes which make various classes of people citizens at birth, even though born outside the US, even to a foreign citizen parent and a US Citizen parent, rather than two US citizens, with conditions of course. Conditions which Obamam's mother failed, if he was born outside the US.

264 posted on 09/16/2009 10:17:47 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: PaultheMan
Besides, the fact that his father was a British subject was well known BEFORE Obama became president and if there were any substantial law which prevented him from becoming president, why did NO ONE on a national level (such as the Republican Party) challenge his placement on the ballot for that reason?

We are seeing what happens to anyone, Hillary, Bill, tea party participants, who challenge The One. They are termed Racists, and beat about the head and shoulders incessantly in the press.

269 posted on 09/16/2009 11:20:49 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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