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The Psychology of Debt — and Obama’s Rendezvous with Political Reality [Victor Davis Hanson]
pajamasmedia.com ^ | July 16, 2009 | Victor Davis Hanson

Posted on 07/17/2009 5:02:07 AM PDT by Tolik

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1 posted on 07/17/2009 5:02:07 AM PDT by Tolik
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http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/victordavishanson/index:
On Shearing Sheep (relentless hostility to small business)
The War Against the Producers
Growing Worries about Our Pied Piper
What is Wisdom?—Sarah Palin and Her Critics
Laugh or Cry? deconstructing Maureen Dowd
A Thug’s Primer - How to win liberal friends and oppress your people
Writing Sarah Off
Missing Our Moment in Iran. Obama’s policy is a lose/lose proposition that will please neither side
Some Hypocrisies Are Not Hypocrisies
Thoughts on a Schizophrenic Society
Obama and the ‘Noble Lie’
What Do these First Six Months Mean? Where Are We Going?
The New Orwellianism
Reflections on the Iranian Enigma. The World Turned Upside Down
Still a Boor and a Coward [Victor Davis Hanson on Letterman, Wright + Thoughts on a Creepy Culture]
A Boor and a Coward [Victor Davis Hanson tears apart the creep, a.k.a David Letterman]
Our Historically Challenged President. A list of distortions
I No Longer Quite Believe ... [Victor Davis Hanson on Orwellian media & science, race relations]
The Reckoning. Obama Versus the Way of the Universe
President Palin’s First 100 Days. Imagine if Sarah Palin had Obama’s record
Confessions of a Contrarian [deconstructing Obama, the Left and more]
President Obama’s First 70 Days. It really does all make sense
Thoughts About Depressed Americans
Bush Did It. What a difference an election makes [Brilliant Parody]
Our Battered American [gets angrier - Must Read Rant]
Just a partial list. Much more at the link:  http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/victordavishanson/index
2 posted on 07/17/2009 5:02:37 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: neverdem; Lando Lincoln; SJackson; dennisw; kellynla; monkeyshine; Alouette; nopardons; ...


    Victor Davis Hanson Ping ! 

       Let me know if you want in or out.

Links:    FR Index of his articles:  http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/keyword?k=victordavishanson
                His website: http://victorhanson.com/
                NRO archive: http://www.nationalreview.com/hanson/hanson-archive.asp
                Pajamasmedia:
   http://victordavishanson.pajamasmedia.com/

3 posted on 07/17/2009 5:03:21 AM PDT by Tolik
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I'd like to clarify something that Hanson says (as I see it):

... Consider the political effects of Bill Clinton’s two budget surplus years — and ignore the ongoing argument to what effect they were the result of creative accounting, not sustainable, or any of the other conservatives rationalizations use to deprecate the achievement. The truth is that they were, and are, now accepted as unusual achievements.

... So just assume that by hook and crook Clinton balanced the budget and examine the ensuing political fallout (We are talking politics now, not economics).

By the end of his term, the United States was headed into a recession. The president was mired in sexual scandal and had been impeached, and yet his ratings remained overwhelmingly positive. Clearly part of the Clintonian resilience was because Americans not only were relieved that they were not piling up debt on their children, but through modest surpluses were making some progress in paying down the national debt. And they gave Clinton credit (not just the Republican Congress that forced him to stop excessive spending), which trumped his otherwise deplorable behavior.

As you can see, Hanson knows the argument that Clinton's balanced budget was not quite so and anyway who was really responsible for it - the Republican Congress. The main point remains - the public in large remembers that as "Clinton balanced the budget". We are talking about perception here that reflects the reality, but not the reality itself. And as we know, in politics perception beats the reality. Especially with the help of our Orwellian Media.

4 posted on 07/17/2009 5:16:11 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: Tolik

Dr. Hanson is wrong when he says “Bush at least gave us tax cuts — but a large deficit. “

The deficits ballooned after 9/11 to protect the nation. In FY2007, the deficit was down to $250 billion and on a clear multi-year trajectory toward a balanced budget. The Democrat engineered train wreck of the economy (by forcing banks to abandon lending standards so the poorest of the poor could own a home with an ARM) is what destroyed the financial system and led us to the current mess including the $2 TRILLION deficit, 8 times larger than Bush’s last full year in office.

I like Dr. Hanson a lot, but at times his Democrat background continues to seep through his otherwise impeccable logic.


5 posted on 07/17/2009 5:29:17 AM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: Tolik
Americans ... were relieved that they were ... through modest surpluses were making some progress in paying down the national debt.

Not true.

The National Debt has not decreased year-to-year since 1957.

On June 30, 1957 the debt was about $2 billion less than it was on June 30, 1956.

Here is the historical record.

There were a couple of years in the late 1990s when the debt "only" went up $20 billion or so, but it's been up continuously every single year since 1957.

6 posted on 07/17/2009 5:34:25 AM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: DuncanWaring; ProtectOurFreedom
See my post #4. I think Hanson tried, but was not strong enough to stress the point that he is talking about political perceptions and not the economic realities.

There were a couple of years in the late 1990s when the debt "only" went up $20 billion

True. But in the public eye it was as good as balanced budget, especially comparing to what we have now.

7 posted on 07/17/2009 5:49:17 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: Tolik
Total federal tax collected in 2008 about 2.5 trillion dollars. 2009 tax collections will be lower.

2009-2010 budget 3.6 trillion dollars.

I'm not sure how much of the stimulus/tarp shush fund is part of the budget.

New Obamacare plan costs? Wildly low (lying) estimate of 1 trillion dollars over ten years with 587 billion dollars in savings because government is running it. (How can these fark heads lie so boldly?)

Last year we paid about 451 billion dollars in interest on our national debt. With the additional trillion dollar stimulus, trillion dollar deficit in this years budget, we could see interest payments on the debt top 1 trillion dollars per year by the end of Obama's ruination of our countries economy. Especially if interest rates start going nuts and we have to funnel money through Goldman Sachs or the Fed to other countries to make it look like they are still buying up our debt. Remember our tax collections in 2008 were only 2.5 trillion dollars.

57 trillion dollars in UNFUNDED liabilities that our government has promised it's citizens. Not counting city and state pensions that are under funded. The cities and states are depending on taxes to increase each year to fund their pensions.

Remember our tax collections in 2008 were 2.5 trillion dollars.

Is that some scary math or what?

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

And they say the Obama care is going to cost 100 billion dollars per year? They are f'n lying!!! If we have 50 million uninsured and spending 100 billion to Obamacare them, they are talking about providing medical care for 50 million people at $2,000 per year! I've been trying to track down how many people are getting Medicare and Medicaid to determine how far 682 billion dollars a year goes? Does anyone know?

8 posted on 07/17/2009 6:03:24 AM PDT by listenhillary (90% of our problems could be resolved with a government 10% of the size it is now.)
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To: Tolik

CONGRESS writes the budget. CONGRESS passes the budget. The president does NOT have a line item veto. He either passes it or vetoes it. If he vetoes it, CONGRESS stops paying the bills for everything. It just doesn’t work!

There needs to be a constitutional amendment to permit the line item veto.


9 posted on 07/17/2009 6:09:07 AM PDT by BillM
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To: BillM

What exactly is wrong with Congress stopping paying the bills for everything?

I’m not afraid of a “government shutdown”. Shut it down permanently.


10 posted on 07/17/2009 6:19:52 AM PDT by MichiganConservative (Your government has harmed mankind more than all the evil done by evil men in the name of my God.)
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To: MichiganConservative

Remember when Gingrich tried it from the congress side. It isn’t really possible with the current size of government.


11 posted on 07/17/2009 6:36:59 AM PDT by BillM
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To: Tolik
"And Barack Obama, who admittedly came to office amid a liquidity crisis that called for fiscal stimulus..."

I quit reading right there.

This Keynesian nonsense is the old democrat coming out in Hanson.

12 posted on 07/17/2009 6:53:09 AM PDT by Doodle
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To: Doodle
This Keynesian nonsense is the old democrat coming out in Hanson.

You are absolutely right! It won't faze the Hanson worshipers here, however. They see him as a sage philosopher and historian who can do no wrong. Interestingly, Hanson barely uttered a whimper of protest against Bush's big government policies including the bailouts. It seems that he only trots out the free market purple prose when Democrats are in office. His first and foremost concern is spreading Wilsonian Democracy around the world, not fighting big government at home.

13 posted on 07/17/2009 7:00:18 AM PDT by Captain Kirk
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To: listenhillary
Remember our tax collections in 2008 were 2.5 trillion dollars.

#####

I would like to ban the word 'trillion'. Even billion does not mean much to the average person. Thousandbillion is a much better way to document what is happening - as the CBO graphic does: Total $2,979 B

Or 'trillion-with-twelve-zeros' should become one word whenever money is being discussed.

14 posted on 07/17/2009 7:10:17 AM PDT by maica (Politics is not about facts. it is about what politicians can get people to believe. - Thomas Sowell)
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To: ProtectOurFreedom
The deficits ballooned after 9/11 to protect the nation.

How did "no child left behind" and medicare drug programs protect the nation. The facts are Bush and his Republican Congress were big spenders.

15 posted on 07/17/2009 7:32:56 AM PDT by CharacterCounts (November 4, 2008 - the day America drank the Kool-Aid)
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To: Tolik
While I like Hanson ignores the role of credit, the tech and housing bubbles on the nation’s economy. He also is putting too much faith in the issue of debt on voter's decision making. In 2006 the vote as all about Iraq and a federal government that appeared incompetent as the economy had not tanked and the deficits were falling. In 2008 it was all about Bush fatigue, scandals, a desire for a new direction and the lack of a competent republican candidate.

The American people for the most part are too ignorant of the impact of policy decisions on their lives. It will be years before we have to face the music on what the Democrats have done since 2007 and especially starting this year.

16 posted on 07/17/2009 8:25:16 AM PDT by misterrob (A society that burdens future generations with debt can not be considered moral or just)
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To: misterrob
It will be years before we have to face the music on what the Democrats have done since 2007.

I wish I had your optimism.

17 posted on 07/17/2009 8:27:09 AM PDT by listenhillary (90% of our problems could be resolved with a government 10% of the size it is now.)
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To: listenhillary

What makes me sound like an optimist? We have not seen the effect of government health care, cap and tax or massive deficits yet.


18 posted on 07/17/2009 8:29:03 AM PDT by misterrob (A society that burdens future generations with debt can not be considered moral or just)
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To: misterrob

That it will be years before we have to face the music.


19 posted on 07/17/2009 8:29:55 AM PDT by listenhillary (90% of our problems could be resolved with a government 10% of the size it is now.)
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To: listenhillary

It will be.....


20 posted on 07/17/2009 8:32:34 AM PDT by misterrob (A society that burdens future generations with debt can not be considered moral or just)
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