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To: expatpat

Okay, no automatic transmission.

But a turbine is a relatively simple machine compared to a reciprocating piston engine. Oil splashing around in a pan, and pumped to the top. A water jacket and radiator. Valves that require precise timing with expensive cams or more expensive computer controlled lifters. Precise fuel and air metering. Pistons and rings beating themselves to death at the end of a fly wheel. The whole thing threatening to stop working if one part fails. A real Rube Goldberg contraption that only works because of tinking by thousands of geniuses over 100 years.

How many machines do you need to make the parts for one turbine? Now think of how many different machines you need for every screw, nut, hose, shaft, gear, pump, spark plug, etc for an ICE.

In addition, a gasoline engine needs rebuild at about 3000 hours when ran at peak effiency and a diesel will need a rebuild at 10,000 hours. A turbine is good for what 50-100k hours?


105 posted on 06/12/2009 11:54:03 AM PDT by dangerdoc (dangerdoc (not actually dangerous any more))
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To: dangerdoc
But a turbine is a relatively simple machine compared to a reciprocating piston engine.

Hmmmmmm. I'm not sure I agree with that. Turbines are simple in concept -- 'one' moving part --- but the tolerances and stresses that part experiences are extremely severe.

These micro turbines operate at something approaching 100,000 RPM. The 'one' moving part consists of a shaft with dozens of compressor blades that require perfect balance on one end, and dozens of other blades also in perfect balance in the combustion chamber on the other side where the temperatures reach 2000 degrees.

These aren't big hunks of steel like pistons. They are very thin castings of high tech alloys facing enormous stresses that will literally rip themselves apart with the smallest imperfection. Plus you have other parts such as igniters that face a harsh environment, fuel valves and filters, and some complex controls.

I wouldn't necessarily call them 'simple' machines.

As to 'overhaul' I'm not sure what the times are for these microturbines. For the most part, they are not designed for continuous operation. They are primarily designed for emergency back-up power applications so their total hours of service is relatively short. In a typical vehicle, they would be used every day for an hour or more with a great many 'heat-up / cool down' cycles.

All that said. I do like the concept of this vehicle. Let's just see how it does in the real world before we go crazy on it.

111 posted on 06/12/2009 1:05:39 PM PDT by Ditto
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To: dangerdoc
But a turbine is a relatively simple machine.

In concept it is. In practice, it is not, as evidenced by the very much higher cost. It's practical operation is quite demanding, due to the high-temperatures and high speeds that the turbine works at.

The whole thing threatening to stop working if one part fails.You should see what happens when one part of a turbine fails!

Perhaps you can explain why a turbine engine is so expensive if it is so simple......

115 posted on 06/12/2009 1:35:00 PM PDT by expatpat
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