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To: Liberty1970
"What is needed is not "philosophical reasoning" but scientific induction - that is, an understanding of the operation of natural processes such that we can predict both what nature does and does not do."

Okay. So can you show how philosophical reasoning 'scientific induction' demonstrates that bluejeans are manmade? Exactly what 'natural processes' do you have to understand to conclude that these crazy pants are made by people?

Me, I think I'll stick with evidence, thanks. And just because my general levity, you needn't assume that admissible evidence is only constituted of physical eye-sight inspection of bluejean factories.

"It is the scientifically knowledgeable person who knows with confidence what nature can and cannot do."

WHAT

You've a pretty bizarre view of science there son.

"History...is also full of naive and pretentious declarations that nature has achieved something that is quite contrary to scientific laws and principles."

Quite so good sir, it is nothing more than impudence for those Wright brothers to claim their gadgetistical contraption allows them to fly through the air. Why, human flight violates all scientific laws and principles! I say this, for I am a scientifically knowledgeable person, and I know with confidence what nature can and cannot do. Harrumph!

And don't get me started on that despicable wench Mrs Curie and her 'radium'.

92 posted on 03/24/2009 3:39:27 PM PDT by oldmanreedy
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To: oldmanreedy
"It is the scientifically knowledgeable person who knows with confidence what nature can and cannot do."

You've a pretty bizarre view of science there son.

Is it bizarre to conclude, for example, that if water boils at 100 degrees C at 1 atmosphere pressure, then it will not boil at 105 C or 95 C under the same conditions? I don't think I am the one with a bizarre view if you deny the fact that science tells us not only what nature does, but what it does not do.

I find it peculiar that you would first ask me to provide a detailed accounting for how we know blue jeans are designed artifacts, and then admit to me that you believe the same yourself. You seem to be saying that you believe they are designed without being able to provide criteria. Indeed your reaction above about my 'bizarre' views indicates a hostility to the whole idea of using criterion besides direct observation to identify design.

So it is you, not I, who should be justifying just how you claim to believe blue jeans are designed artifacts.

To take it a step further, how would you identify the activity of an unknown genetic engineer (a bio-terrorist for example), who actively altered DNA to create a new plague? Consistent methodological naturalists of the sort you represent cannot allow people to even speculate that such a thing can happen, even if a million people were dying of it in the streets and a portion of the altered DNA was coded "COURTESY OF AL-QUAIDA" in morse code. This philosophy has boxed you into an absurd straitjacket of naturalism.

94 posted on 03/25/2009 6:49:02 AM PDT by Liberty1970 (Democrats are not in control. God is. And Thank God for that!)
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