Science's Alternative to an Intelligent Creator: the Multiverse Theory

Discover ^ | Nov 26, 2008 | Tim Folger

[null and void]

[Jeff Gordon]

So civilization is your God - your supreme moral force.

Wrong conclusion. God is my God. My God gave man free will.

So the Nazi opinion of what was right

Congratulations. Godwin in two. Your second sentence in your second post to me. Have a nice life.

[sasquatch]

The “science” idiots will never even imagine the power and depth of our GOD let alone argue about what HE created. To start with GOD created “science”.

Hawk Man, I believe that God let man use science to cope.
Aloha,
Sasquatch

[sasquatch]

... and some cope well; others have issues...

[Grizzled Bear]

“What a guy!”

[null and void]

BONGO: I know that this prob'ly won't interest you, but I'd hate myself for the rest of my life if I didn't at least suggest it.
ACE: Suggest what?
BONGO: If you're interested, I'll be in my quarters at lunchtime, covered in torama salada.
ACE: I didn't know your bread was buttered that side, Bongo.
BONGO: It isn't. I've been happily married for 35 years. It's just, a chap like you can turn a guy's head.
ACE: I'm sorry, Bongo. Lunch is...on Mellie.
BONGO: Would it make any difference if it was...hummus?
ACE: I'm sorry, Bongo. I'm strictly "butter-side-up."
BONGO: Understood. (ACE leaves the office.) What a guy!

[fish hawk]

Sometimes I think that God uses Science like dangling the carrot out on a stick to follow and discover new things. But when we go farther out into space than ever before we find, not the edge, but that it goes on and on. Then we look into atomic microscopes and we find things smaller than the atom and then infinitely smaller even still as the scopes get improved. For every “answer” we find, a million new questions appear. For sure God didn't want us to get bored. LOL Aloha my friend.

[null and void]

Sometimes I suspect we are here to keep Him from getting bored.

[AndyTheBear]

...it doesn’t pertain to what we were talking about.

The competence of journalists writing about science aside, it seemed that the idea that the universe was uniquely suitable for life has even been grudgingly accepted by naturalists, who attempt to employ the "anthropological principle" to ward off the notion that such is evidence of God. The idea is something like: only universes which are ideal for producing observers will be so ideally suited to produce observers.

I was kinda skipping ahead to where I thought the conversation logically lead.

I can not let is pass that I view the anthropological argument as logically fallacious (I am happy to argue why I think this with those who disagree). But certainly its common use demonstrates that the journalist is far from alone in his assessment that this universe is well suited for life...even among those who have a stake in not acknowledging such a conclusion.

[Psycho_Bunny]

Statistically speaking, the universe couldn't possibly be more ill-suited for life as we understand it. It's so hostile that it boggles the mind we exist at all (aside from existence, itself being mind-boggling.)

People who throw around statements like "The universe is perfectly suited for life" are simply not being careful with their words...and making a host of conclusions they're in no position to make.

[AndyTheBear]

I was granting the context in which Naturalism might be correct...thus granting Darwin's idea of common origin for life, and the popular astrophysical view of a big bang (which I happen to think are probably more or less accurate).

I guess you were not being as generous to the Naturalists as I was.

Statistically speaking, the universe couldn't possibly be more ill-suited for life as we understand it.

Well I will certainly agree this universe (including any "multiverse" of which it is a part, or any other naturalist idea of the cosmos) is not suited for eternal life...but it seems suited for fallen life, on a sad doomed march toward eventual oblivion.

Modern physics has found that space itself has a finite size, a finite amount of matter, and has existed for a finite amount of time. There are a finite number of particles in the Universe, and a finite number of positions the particles can occupy. The idea of infinity only seems to exist in the human mind...nature doesn't have any real examples of it.

There is no real meaning in the natural world, excepting in the human spirit.

I am only an amateur theologian, and I may be wrong, but my sense is that Eden wasn't really in this cosmos, that humankind was banished to this fallen place from a reality that transcends this one.