Sorry, Allmendream. It doesn’t get any plainer than our last exchange on the thread:
ME: PS First you agree to debate, then you back out. Hmmmmm.....
Allmendream (who, as usual, issues insults when cornered): I am not interested in debating a conspiracy theorist.
ME: I offered a debate between you and one of the thousands of scientists who officially question the HIV-AIDS hypothesis. The debate was going to be focused on the science of AIDS alone. You accepted the debate and then backed out. Furthermore, I cited paper after paper, written by your fellow evos, every one of which stated that there are indeed codes upon codes. Your issue is with them, not me. And in this connection, I also floated a debate between you and a creation scientist. As per usual, you failed to rise to the challenge. Thus, it is you who are running away, not me...In short, put up or shut up.
Allmendream: NO RESPONSE
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1941583/posts?q=1&;page=151#155
Sorry but the research on HIV and AIDS has progressed to the point that the Scientists working on it are either correct in their assumption or engaged in fraud on a massive scale. Not the Scientists like me who work in unrelated fields and accept their conclusions, I mean the actual Scientists working on the HIV virus. There is no possibility that they are just mistaken at this point, they are either essentially correct, or engaged in massive fraud.
I am not interested in debating a conspiracy theorist. I am perfectly willing to discuss Science, and debate the implications and meanings of the data. But if you think they are ‘Liars Liars Pants on Fire’ right from the beginning, while your granola eating anti-corporate raw foodist coffee enema having nutters are obviously truth-tellers of the highest order.
IF YOU HAVE DATA PRESENT IT AND I WILL ENGAGE IT. Otherwise it is YOU who first backed down from defending the ASININE and IDIOTIC article at the head of this thread that cannot even keep translation and transcription differentiated to chase a red herring of HIV AIDS which has nothing to do with the subject.
(emphasis added for those of you in Rio Linda)
Seems that was my response to your proposed debate.
If you have DATA, you need to PRESENT it, in order for me to ENGAGE or otherwise DEBATE it.
163 posted on Sunday, January 06, 2008 7:35:07 AM by allmendream
From jas3
Answering AIDS Denialists and AIDS Lies
The Durban declaration states: “The evidence that AIDS is caused by HIV-1 or HIV-2 is clear-cut, exhaustive and unambiguous, meeting the highest standards of science.” And also, “HIV causes AIDS. It is unfortunate that a few vocal people continue to deny the evidence. This position will cost countless lives.”
What bona fide AIDS researchers and activists will and will not do when countering AIDS denialists
We will:
Expose the lies and the factual misrepresentations made by the denialists, particularly when these appear in the mainstream media.
Expose individual cases of avoidable illness or death caused by the actions of denialists.
Make supervising authorities or professional organizations aware of conduct by AIDS denialists, particularly scientists, journalists and civil servants, which breaches the normal standards of professional ethics or competence.
Assist investigative journalists in uncovering the financial links between AIDS profiteers and the AIDS denialists who provide mutual support to each other.
Provide factual information on HIV/AIDS to legitimate, mainstream journalists and bona fide members of the public (i.e. not AIDS denialists or agent provocateurs).
We will not:
Engage in any public or private debate with AIDS denialists or respond to requests from journalists who overtly support AIDS denialist causes. The reasons are:
The debate has been settled: HIV causes AIDS, AIDS kills, and AIDS can be treated with significant success by the use of antiretroviral therapy. These are the facts.
The information proving the above is already in the peer-reviewed science literature. The scientific facts are ignored, misunderstood or willfully misrepresented by the AIDS denialists. However, it is not our role to enlighten denialists as to their inability to understand the available information.
Debating denialists dignifies their position in a way that is unjustified by the facts about HIV/AIDS. The appropriate way for dissenting scientists to try to persuade other scientists of their views on any scientific subject is by publishing research in the peer-reviewed scientific literature. For many years now, AIDS denialists have been unsuccessful in persuading credible peer-reviewed journals to accept their views on HIV/AIDS, because of their scientific implausibility and factual inaccuracies. That failure does not entitle those who disagree with the scientific consensus on a life-and-death public health issue to then attempt to confuse the general public by creating the impression that scientific controversy exists when it does not.
Our time is better spent conducting research into HIV/AIDS and/or educating the general public about the facts about this virus and the deadly disease it causes.
This November 2003 Nature article shows why debating denialists is a waste of time.
To help prevent lives from being lost due to ignorance or misunderstanding, we have assembled the content below to address the most common assertions made by AIDS denialists:
HIV, AIDS, and the Distortion of Science – Martin Delaney
Does drug use cause AIDS?
The Consequences of HIV Denialism – Dr. Robert Voigt
Joseph Sonnabend, M.D., makes it clear that denialists are including inappropriate references to him in their literature
AIDS Truth member criticizes AIDS denialists
Several denialist websites proclaim that two—even three—Nobel Prize winners question HIV as the cause of AIDS. Is this true? AIDS Truth investigates.
What our work means: Predictive value of plasma HIV RNA level on rate of CD4 T-cell decline in untreated HIV infection
HIV causes AIDS: An independent review of the evidence
Debunking the Myths of the AIDS Denialists
Response to the Seven Deadly Deceptions
CD4 Counts and Viral Load
Drugs, Disease, Denial
HIV, AIDS, and the Distortion of Science
AIDS denialism: still crazy after all these years - and still killing people in South Africa
Price of Denial by Mark Heywood
Bad Science: Former Denialists Wake Up
Lies, Damned Lies and Dr. Rath
Nature Medicine Editorial: Denying Science
The Curious Case of AIDS Denialist Roberto Giraldo
Echoes of Lysenko: State-sponsored Pseudoscience in South Africa
Correcting the AIDS Lies
HIV denialists ignore large gap in the study they cite
Denying AIDS and the Rwandan Genocide?
Misrepresentation of the Concorde trial perpetuated by AIDS denialists, particularly Anthony Brink
Words of Dr. Harvey Bialy
165 posted on Friday, January 11, 2008 9:44:27 PM by jas3