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To: allmendream

Well for one, the modern reading of free exercise/establishment clause of the First Amendment does not comport with the original intent of the founders.


393 posted on 08/19/2008 3:29:06 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: allmendream

What’s the matter Allmendream, is this debate too hard for you too?


394 posted on 08/19/2008 3:39:30 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts
Saying so doesn't make it so; do you think Jefferson or Madison would embrace the establishment of Christianity as the official religion that should be taught at public schools?

How is the reading of the First in any way a departure from Madison's intent.

Madison's summary of the First Amendment:

Congress should not establish a religion and enforce the legal observation of it by law, nor compel men to worship God in any manner contary to their conscience, or that one sect might obtain a pre-eminence, or two combined together, and establish a religion to which they would compel others to conform (Annals of Congress, Sat Aug 15th, 1789 pages 730 - 731).

“The civil Government, though bereft of everything like an associated hierarchy, possesses the requisite stability, and performs its functions with complete success, whilst the number, the industry, and the morality of the priesthood, and the devotion of the people, have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the church from the State” Madison (Letter to Robert Walsh, Mar. 2, 1819).

“Strongly guarded as is the separation between religion and & Gov’t in the Constitution of the United States the danger of encroachment by Ecclesiastical Bodies, may be illustrated by precedents already furnished in their short history” Madison (Detached Memoranda, circa 1820).

“Every new and successful example, therefore, of a perfect separation between the ecclesiastical and civil matters, is of importance; and I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in showing that religion and Government will both exist in greater purity the less they are mixed together” Madison (Letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822).

“I must admit moreover that it may not be easy, in every possible case, to trace the line of separation between the rights of religion and the civil authority with such distinctness as to avoid collisions and doubts on unessential points. The tendency to a usurpation on one side or the other or to a corrupting coalition or alliance between them will be best guarded against by entire abstinence of the government from interference in any way whatever, beyond the necessity of preserving public order and protecting each sect against trespasses on its legal rights by others.” Madison (Letter Rev. Jasper Adams, Spring 1832).

“To the Baptist Churches on Neal's Greek on Black Creek, North Carolina I have received, fellow-citizens, your address, approving my objection to the Bill containing a grant of public land to the Baptist Church at Salem Meeting House, Mississippi Territory. Having always regarded the practical distinction between Religion and Civil Government as essential to the purity of both, and as guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States, I could not have otherwise discharged my duty on the occasion which presented itself” Madison (Letter to Baptist Churches in North Carolina, June 3, 1811).

397 posted on 08/19/2008 3:49:45 PM PDT by allmendream (If "the New Yorker" makes a joke, and liberals don't get it, is it still funny?)
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