Story of evolution can be seen as comedy of errors (The Ancient Hiccup, Male Hernias, and more)

Philadephia Enquirer via Houston Chronicle ^ | Saturday, April 26, 2008 | Faye Flam

[marktwain]

“Evolve includes origin, doesn’t it?”
No, it does not, or at minimum, it is not required.

“You must have a starting point in order to measure (apparent) change.’

You can pick any point in a sequence to measure change, either backward of forward.

Yes, history does not have enough time to explain all the evolution that we have evidence for. Pre-history has plenty of time, though.

[Mr. Jeeves]

Correcting the bizarrely formatted tagline...

[Mr. Jeeves]

OK, now it should work. ;)

[WVKayaker]

I have admitted to my faith in God. I have no better argument, nor need one to justify myself. I am merely offering you an opportunity to get to know Him better. You prefer to bask in your intelligence and display of knowledge.

I merely measured a 167 IQ on the standardized tests back in the 60's. Now, I am 60, and have grown acquainted with how little I know, much less the amount of information I can process, at any rate.

I have formal education and lots more from the school of hard knocks. I have been to war, and have seen the whites of their eyes. I have suffered loss, and gained more in replacement. I love the life that I live, and know my Creator personally.

I have studied "religions", and have made my own conclusions. I accept those things of which I do not have complete knowledge. I seek to know more.

I talk with God. You call it prayer. I am mere mortal, but He offers me hope. He is as real, to me, as the keyboard upon which I type... and He loves you, too. He gave His life for you. Believe it, or not.

[CarrotAndStick]

Can you give a single documented instance of a species which became extinct because it didn't adapt (through evolution) to changing environments? Most extinctions were probably due to catastrophic events like extraterrestrial impacts, volcanic eruptions, etc., from which evolution offers no protection.

Google "living fossils". Postulate why they are so rare.

[hellbender]

OK. Let’s hear all about the many intermediate stages of testicular migration. Please note that I am not talking about lack of intermediate evolutionary steps in general; obviously they exist. But this testicle issue involves all sorts of linked and profound changes. The critter has to develop warm-bloodedness (a big step in itself) in order for external gonads to be necessary or desirable. The testicles have to move, which involves changes in many internal structures. A canal has to form to convey them out of the body cavity without leaking other structures. All the plumbing and blood supply to support the new testicle location has to be arranged. A scrotum has to be created where nothing was before. It’s not as simple as the facile arguments of the “pop” evolutionists suggest.

[teeman8r]

thanks for your thoughts...
one of the many miraculous examples i use to affirm my belief in god is that, without a master planning this big mess, the chances of a planet, the exact distance from a star to house life, having a moon the exact size and distance from that planet to fit within that sun’s shape to cause such a beautiful phenomena as the solar eclipse cannot be a happenstance of mear chance...

the artistry of god’s creation is awe inspiring and i haven’t seen a majority of it yet... and will never... heaven must be something.

teeman

[CarrotAndStick]

Well, good for you.

It’s not as if I don’t want God. I just don’t want to trap myself in euphoric illogic. So, that leaves it upto God to rectify me, I guess.

[hellbender]

You don’t respond to my challenge. Name a single species which we know “became extinct because it didn’t adapt to changing environments.” The changes which killed off most species were too rapid for evolution to deal with. And there are quite a few “living fossils.” The horseshoe crab is almost unchanged in 200 million years.

[trebb]

Gee, according to the Bible, our imperfections came out of disobedience and some day our bodies will be made perfect and eternal as God originally designed them. I'll look at the improbability of the Bible being written over a few thousand years, by over a hundred authors, and managing to not contradict itself, and compare it to a bunch of scientists who are always guessing and theorizing about things, while changing their opinions/theories every few years or so. Once done, I'll give God His due credit.

Have a great day.

[canuck_conservative]

from which evolution offers no protection

Well if it gave no protection, then every living thing would have been wiped out by past natural disasters. Meaning we wouldn't be here now.

But obviously that's not the case, is it? So everything that survived must have had some evolutionary advantage in the past, whether than meant living in protective lakes and oceans when meteors hit, or better exterior covering, or whatever.

Open your eyes, buddy. There's a world of evidence all around you, and even inside you! Why do I have to keep holding your hand?

[CarrotAndStick]

Single species?

Where are the three-foot wingspan dragonflies today?

Only the higher-oxygen ratio air of prehistory could have supported such sizes.

[CarrotAndStick]

You mean, those people who wrote the Bible or any other religious text had no axe to grind, especially with the teeming, illiterate, unwashed masses that they sought to influence, for good or bad? Is that why various books of the Bible had to be discovered, rejected or accepted, over time? Is that why the Laws of Moses needed amendment- a new Law written? As for dramatc, public miracles, they all seem to happen mysteriously 2000+ years ago. Is it a coincidence that they all happened at a time when the masses feared raising uncomfortable questions? All pointing to divine perfection, I bet.

[CarrotAndStick]

Horseshoe crabs of today are a tiny fraction of the sizes they once were, as per their fossil records. Might the size-change adaptation been brought about by the reduction in oxygen percentages, as evidenced by ancient glacial ice-bubble analysis?

Add to that, internal changes- like resisting new diseases.

[WVKayaker]

So how do you think it all started? Or did it just “evolve” from nothing? How old is the earth? What is “pre-history”? Please show me your wisdom... so I, too, can be enlightened. I must be a rube.

[CarrotAndStick]

Naw, you’d be a lot better off believing in hocus-pocus.

[WVKayaker]

I have no idea how old is the Earth. Some people cling to Bishop Ushher's 7000 years, but I see enough proof to believe otherwise. I drive through mountain slashes, which reveal striations of various layers of detritus. Some contain fossilized things and all show the ravages and upheavals of time. Some stripes are vertical, folded upon each other, others are perfectly flat.

I grew up along the shores of various oceans. I had a driveway covered with "Marl", which is nothing more than deteriorated sea stuff, layered along the coastal plains. It packs as good as concrete, but needs something to keep the dust down. It contains lots of fossils.

Yet, with all the "fossil" evidence, there can only be speculation among the science priests. They say they don't need to explain origin, and can surely identify changes which are clear and apparent evidence affirming their religious beliefs and knowledge. Why, because their are too many dots not connected, and too much time must have passed. Of course, pre-history is a convenient explanation. We just call it Genesis 1, and 2...

[WVKayaker]

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

2 Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day...

[WVKayaker]

6 And God said, “Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water.” 7 So God made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the expanse “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

[WVKayaker]

9 And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.