Posted on 04/23/2008 1:30:49 PM PDT by Between the Lines
Aye Mate: there is!
And the post to which you are refering contained Scripture verse and 'scripture' verse.
Just WHICH of those do YOU consider SPAM®?
The CLEAR description and warning about those 'personages' or the BoM's story about Joseph Smith and the Angels of Light?
So again, by your understanding, which way is the right way that God uses to save us?
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You, by your own admission, believe in the RESTORED Gospel.
You, by the standards of your own church, are a member of the ONLY true church.
You, have all the knowledge required to make sure a person makes it to heaven.
You will state that the ONLY way to be saved
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I did not ask you.
I did not ask myself.
So go away.
Here's how I would feel: I'd be pissed because I'm not a child rapist, I don't know any child rapists, and there is no child rape going on in my house.
Can the FLDS folks at the Bring'em Young Ranch say the same?
No such luck!
Joseph Smith either made it up out of the depths of his mind; or he was lied to and deceived by two angels of light.
One way only.
There is no plan B.
(I shortened this up by about a hundred lines)
Stop voting your emotions.
Crank calls can ruin perfectly good lives and, unless there's a lot more to the story, this thing took off on either a crank call or a local agency's set up.
Are they guilty of something?
I don't know
it seems very possible
but ends do not justify means!
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As I studied back in the middle of the last century, and as it still is today, man has read the Bible and has come up with many different ways to be saved.
I do not believe the following, but you act like many I have met before.
Since you have chosen to not address this problem, I will take you for one of the believers that thinks God will only save His chosen few, His elect.
He has also decided that the rest of us will not be saved, just because of his pleasure.
And on top of that, He has sent you, one of the elect saved beings, to insure that the rest of us know we are not saved and will burn in hell for the rest of eternity, Just for His pleasure.
Again, I do not believe this is the way we are saved, but you sure do act like someone who does.
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You only gave part of the answer. It was our Father in heaven, and His Son, that visited Joseph Smith.
I believe it was The Father and His Son.
Hey Dufus. Read all my posts to find a defense of their “lifestyle” if you can. I defend their rights not their “lifestyle”. Do a little reading on Patrick Henry to figure out what he said about defending others rights when he did not agree with their philosophy.
You sound like one of those idol CPS employees. Now that you have used the standard Nazi techniques to separate Mother’s from 13 month olds you have plenty of time to contribute to these forums I see. I actually have a real job.
By the way I do not live in Canada but nice try. I originally wanted to call myself colorcountry but they told me some other dufus had it already.
Cute, but in my original post reply #36 I said; "I'm not one to appreciate tinfoil hat conspiracy theory but this sounds actually plausible."
I only meant that it is plausible that a Democrat activist could have made that call with the intent to manipulate the news cycle and disparage those the Left-wing would view as "religious-conservatives."
After that, I responded further when my initial simple post about a phone call appeared to be misconstrued into my believing a Grand Conspiracy involving collusion with Texas, Utah, Arizona, British Columbia, the FBI etc.
I am still troubled by the fact that a known Democrat activist in the Obama campaign was able to make a fraudulent call and and elicit such a massive and ill-conceived response from authorities in Texas.
Mind reading alert!
I believe it was The Father and His Son.
Then you BELIEVE against direct descriptions in the bible.
HOW on earth can an entire religion get started this way?
Talk about BLIND faith!
Talk about a CRANK phone call!
It wasn’t the only call and it wasn’t without knowledge of what this group was about. The authorities had every reason to take it seriously.
This group has a decades long well documented history.
Warren Jeffs is in jail for the very thing this girl claims to have happened to her.
This call likely had more credibility than just about any other call they’ve ever received.
If they had ignored it and harm had come to the girl, the same state and CPS that’s getting shredded for acting would get shredded for not acting. You know the routine: *When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.* and all the other LEO bashing that goes on when the DON’T respond quickly enough and someone gets injured or dies.
That remains to be seen. I'm certain that the entire warrant procedure will be gone over with a fine toothed comb, there are some shysters out there who would be glad to make themselves a name by getting the FLDS off the hook, and then suing the hell out of the Texas taxpayers for the big payday.
It is horrible, awful, and detestable to me what the FLDS do to their children. But know that a lot of liberals feel that way about parents who home-school their children, too, and the 4th Amendment is set up to protect us all from fishing expeditions that end up ruining the lives of innocent people. Finding out about this Swinton woman, and the possibility that she faked the call to give an excuse for the authorities to start the raid really makes me question this whole "end justifies the means" attitude I had about this situation.
Even if that call was a fake and it was the only one, which it’s allegedly not, there’s just so much background on this group. This is far from a fishing expedition. The cult’s history is well documented. IMO, this should have happened upon Jeffs conviction.
Any call to social services can be a fake but they have to be investigated anyway. When they were investigating this one, they found enough evidence for a second search warrant, which they are legally permitted to act on. They didn’t violate the Fourth. They got search warrants both times they went in, and as far as I know, that is not standard procedure for investigations of child abuse. They made sure the bases were covered.
There’s another thread that’s just been posted that has way more information. I could ping you to that, or you could do a flds keyword search to find it.
Hey, Einstein, do you remember what you wrote in your post?
That is a question that asks the reader to answer emotionally. So why are you complaining when I did?
"Also, ask yourself how you'd feel if poor li'l Rozita had claimed to be an underage rape victim in your basement."
Crank calls can ruin perfectly good lives
Not as many as religious cults do.
I can think of one crank call that made one of its victims a millionaire because she was stupid enough to believe it. I'm still P.O'd about that.
and, unless there's a lot more to the story, this thing took off on either a crank call or a local agency's set up.
But why wait until we know if it's possible there may be a legitimate reason for the state's action? Finding out there may indeed be fire where everyone knows there is smoke won't help you get your paranoid anti-government ya-yas out.
Are they guilty of something? I don't know it seems very possible but ends do not justify means!
Everybody says that, but I seriously doubt they mean it in every instance. It's a cliché people pull out when they disagree with the means in a particular case.
Would I make a crank call to bail hundreds of children out of a polygamous, possibly pedophilic cult? Probably not. But if that was Rozita Swinton's intent, I'm not going to lie to myself and pretend she's just as bad or worse than the Warren Jeffs pod people.
The following is what I believe, accept it or not FREE WILL the choice is yours:
In the Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments in their original writing as fully inspired by God, and accepts them as the full and final authority for faith and life.
In one God eternally existing in three persons - Father, Son and Holy Spirit. That the Lord Jesus Christ was begotten by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, and is true God and true Man.
That God created man in His image; that man sinned and thereby incurred the penalty of death, physical and spiritual, and that all human beings inherit a sinful nature which issues in actual transgression involving personal guilt.
That the Lord Jesus Christ died for our sins, a substitutionary sacrifice, according to the Scriptures, and that all who believe and trust in Him are justified on the grounds of His shed blood.
In the bodily resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ, His ascension into heaven, and His present life as our High Priest and Advocate.
In the personal return of the Lord Jesus Christ.
In the personality of the Holy Spirit, His regenerating work, and abiding presence in the true believer. That the Holy Spirit indwells all true believers and that He has been sent to be the Comforter and Empowerer of the Christian Church, to produce the fruit of the Holy Spirit and the gifts of the Holy Spirit according to the Scriptures.
That all who repent of their sin and receive the Lord Jesus Christ by faith are born again of the Holy Spirit and thereby become children of God.
That all Christians are called to a life of holiness, devotion to the Lord Jesus Christ and service to Him.
In the resurrection both of the just and the unjust, the eternal blessedness of the redeemed, and the eternal banishment from God of those who have rejected the offer of salvation.
That the whole company of those who have accepted the Lord Jesus Christ as their Saviour have been redeemed by Him and regenerated by the Holy Spirit and form the one true Church, and that each local church on earth should take its character from this concept. Therefore, the new birth and personal confession of faith in Christ are essentials of Church membership.
In the priesthood of all believers in Jesus Christ.
That the ascended Christ has given various ministries or ministers to the Church in order to bring all believers to the place of Christian maturity in the understanding of truth, and the performance and function of the ministry (Ephesians 4:11; Romans 12:4-8 and 1 Corinthians 12:10 ff.).
That the healing of the sick in the name of Jesus Christ is still active in the Church (Mark 16:16-18; Matthew 8:16-17; 1 Corinthians 12:9; James 5:14-15).
That God never removed the gifts of the Holy Spirit from the Church, and that the Scriptural commands to "seek earnestly the best gifts", and to "forbid not to speak in tongues", are still applicable today (1 Corinthians 12,13 & 14:1-39).
That the miracles as recorded in the Bible were real miracles, and are possible in the present day (John 14:12 and 1 Corinthians 12:10).
That all believers are called to fulfil the Great Commission (Matthew 28:18-20).
That Christ is the Head of His body, the Church, and that in all things He has pre-eminence.
Thank you for sharing your beliefs.
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Why is your way of thinking on how we are saved any better then the millions of people who also read and study the Bible and come up with different answers?
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