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I'm not going to pretend that Abram wasn't a polygamist just to prove that Mormonism is wrong. Abram was a polygamist and Mormonism is wrong. [p-marlowe]

No, you just pretend that Hagar wasn't a slave before and after sleeping with Abram.

Why does the "before" matter? Think about it: Just as a minor cannot "consent" to sex, a slave is in no better situation to "consent" to--or deny--her master's commands for sex. And in this case, the command didn't come from her husband, Abram; it came from her mistress (female word for "master"), Sarai (Sarai is twice referenced as "mistress"--Gen. 16:4,8).

Why does the "after" matter? Because it shows she didn't become a "transformed" person--from slave to wifely status. Gen. 16:6,8,9; 21:11; 25:12 all are still referencing her as either a "slave" (twice in 21:11), servant or one who was told by the Angel to submit to her mistress (female word for "master"). By Gen. 25, Abraham is married to Keturah with no mention of Hagar (25:1) and is then buried with Sarah (25:10).

I say to settle this matter, let's call the 5 key witnesses to the stand, and hear what they have to say:

Q Hagar, after Sarai gave you to Abram and Ishmael was conceived, did you still acknowledge Sarai as your "mistress" in your conversation with the Angel of the Lord? [female master]

A Yes. (Gen. 16:8)

Q Sarai, when you were in your early nineties when Isaac was a toddler, how did you characterize Hagar?

A I told Abraham, Get rid of that slave woman and her son, for that slave woman's son will never share in the inheritance with my son, Isaac. (Gen. 21:10)

Q Abraham, after Sarah gave you Hagar and you slept with her, how did you characterize Hagar?

A I told Sarah, as mistress (master) of her servant, Your servant is in your hands. Do with her whatever you think best. (Gen. 16:6)

Q When Sarah began to mistreat her servant, Hagar, did you intervene like what we might expect a husband to do?

A No. Hagar was Sarah's servant.

Q Angel of the Lord, when you called to Hagar after she conceived Ishmael, how did you reference her?

A Servant of Sarai (Gen. 16:8)

Q And when you conversed with Hagar, did you, Angel of the Lord, acknowledge that she was released from her servant role to Sarai?

A No. In fact, I told her Go back to your mistress and submit to her. (Gen. 16:9)

Q Moses, since you wrote Genesis, how did you identify Hagar in her last reference of that book? Did you link her to Abraham?

A No. I identified her as "Sarah's maidservant" (Gen. 25:12).

Q So in that same passage, you link Ishmael to Abraham, but you link Hagar only to Sarah?

Q Yes.

A truly disingenuous post, next you'll hold a seance and tell us the answers came from beyond the grave, I could just as easily manipulate the scriptures to get opposite answers to just as carefully worded questions to make sure Abraham was indeed polygamous, but it boils down to do the scriptures actually say Hagar was Abraham's wife anywhere?

A. Yes

End of story, thanks for playing.

I also find it interesting that you guys seem to have no problem with Abraham being a man who would sleep with the "help", and take concubines (basically having a girlfriend, or a woman on the side from how it's been described here) over him lawfully having more than one wife.

Abraham was a righteous man, which is more in keeping with that statement? "sleeping around", or the "Lawful wife"?

I'm not exactly sure why you guys feel that way, but that is in effect what you are saying when you go this route.

Is adultery preferable to polygamy? Is it better to rape a slave (sex against her will is rape) and force her to bear your child better than to marry her?

Stop this madness, stop insisting that such sin was approved of by God, for in truth such was never the case.