Posted on 12/10/2007 8:56:33 PM PST by joanie-f
As much as we'd like to believe it isn't so, I think there is more than a grain of truth in what he said.
The media are reporting now that Murray supposedly committed suicide. And this report is receiving exponentially more coverage than any previous reports of the details of Amass heroics.
Murray was a man who has been quoted as 'hating Christians', who entered a church armed to the teeth, with several weapons, hundreds of rounds of ammunition, and grenades, presumably in order to take out as many believers as possible. Immediately upon entering the church, he was confronted by an armed, determined woman, who shot and hit him multiple times, and he still had the ammo, and the ability, to return fire ... and yet turned his weapon on himself? A media-created, agenda-driven fairy tale, if I ever heard one.
As for our hero having been fired from the Minneapolis police department for lying about the fact that she had sworn at a bus driver while in the process of handling an incident on a city bus ... the Minneapolis P.D. appears to follow the kind of politically correct dictates that handcuff their officers and allow criminals to call the shots. Thank God the pastor at New Life Church doesn't share their law enforcement philosophy.
Let the mainstream media dig up or fabricate or magnify all out of proportion all the 'dirt' they like on this woman. To rational, informed Americans, such tactics simply serve to demean their credibility yet again. If it weren't for the fact that they are still capable of swaying the uninformed American couch potatoes among us, their obsessive, single-minded rantings would be laughable.
~ joanie
Allegiance and Duty Betrayed
If they want to call it suicide, then at least they can’t call it murder!
When God steps in, the results are often very dramatic. He takes care of everything in one sweep.
I have read a cross-section of coverage via Google News. How the stories are "aimed" is a judgment call, and my judgment differs from yours. I don't see any animosity toward Ms. Amman nor any sympathy for Mr. Murray. Overall impression: Amman was an imperfect person (as are we all) who did a perfect thing when her skill and experience and education all met. Murray met her at the corner of Crazy Street and Stupid Drive.
The media are reporting now that Murray supposedly committed suicide. Yet that report defies all rational logic.
Precisely how? Suicide is the usual endgame for spree killers. The North Hollywood bank robbers had a plan to take themselves out rather than face capture. One died by his own hand, the other at the hand of the LAPD.
Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris planned to die. The Virginia Tech shooter suicided. What you're describing as an anomaly is, in point of fact, the norm. The spree killers who don't kill themselves run out the door and force the police to kill them. Suicide by cop.
Jeanne Assam is a hero in the highest order. The VietNam Vet did his part and I consider him a hero, too. He helped to distract the guy a bit...then comes along Ms Assam...well trained...and did what some men couldn’t do [2 armed security guards guns drawn and wouldn’t fire]...the way she walked toward the perp continuing to fire knowing he was up tight and wounded up little likely hood he could hit her...is the classic defensive approach mode and you do unload a clip...you’ll take the guy down just by the bullets hitting his protective gear...the force of the bullets do that...she again warned him...to stop...he wouldn’t...today he’s dead. I’ll be surprised it the perp even had an opportunity to take himself out...doesn’t really matter...she stopped the killing. Another American Hero...[and there are alot of men FReepers around here extremely impressed with her and that ability]
At the same time, why would a man on such a 'mission' arm himself with several weapons, hundreds of rounds of ammunition, and grenades, shoot only four people outside of the church on his way in, and then, upon entering the church and finding himself confronted by an armed woman, suddenly abandon his obvious plans to take down as many people as possible, and turn one of his weapons on himself? If he had a round at the ready, why would he not have used it to take down the armed person who was standing in the way of his completing his 'mission'?
He surely intended to die -- but if he were to die by his own hand, that event logically would have occurred after he had exhausted all possibilities of taking as many innocents along with him.
I do not believe Murray's death was self-inflicted. Hundreds of rounds of ammunition were not brought into that church on a lark. And he certainly didn't have a change of heart in midstream. He was taken out by someone who was aware of his plans and was not going to allow them to see fruition, even if it meant losing her own life in the process.
~ joanie
Lots of pertinent info, and intelligent commentary, in one brief post. Thanks for the valuable insights!
In High School I ran 40 yards in 4.1 seconds. Nearly 40 yrs. later, it'd probably take a couple more seconds, but that only means I'd have to be closer. But, I'm bigger since high school and when I get to you, it'll hurt more. You and me both.
This 'window' of opportunity will present itself if the perp is trying to clear a jam or changing a mag. Look for it.
Throw a purse, throw anything you can get your hands on at the perp during this time, if that's all you can do, for if nothing else you'll give someone a few more seconds to take him down.
We're talking crazy people here. Their logic is not our logic. When Assam ended Murray's batshit crusade, he checked out before she could make the choice for him.
Every American who might find himself in such a deadly situation (which means every American) should read and seriously reflect on your advice.
We too often figure that these kinds of unexpected tragedies only happen to the other guy, so, when such a horrifying threat rears its head in front of us, there is no time for weighing pros and cons. We need to put ourselves in the positions of potential victims, such as those at New Life this weekend, before we actually become one, and have a plan ready to put into effect in a matter of a few seconds, if we're fortunate.
Your window of opportunity advice is priceless.
Thank you!
~ joanie
Allegiance and Duty Betrayed
You know what? I don't care at this point. She, Jeanne, stopped this deranged killer...that's the fact. At the end, she may have shot and missed, she may have not shot...at the end, the guy died precisely because of Jeanne's heroism.
Either way, the public was saved the cost of confinement and trial...and this killer went on to stand before his Maker, and that judgement is in His hands. Jeanne saved many lives, Jeanne was a heroine here, plain and simple, and IMHO, placed there by the hand of God through His inspiration to her, which she had placed herself in a positon to hear, and which she then acted upon.
If this was a case of "death by armed woman security guard", or death by his own hand because she had stopped him, or death by her final shot...the results are the same, and for the same reasons. That's how I see it, and how I will pass it on to my kids, grand kids...and if I live long enough, to my great grand kids. Though I think the two intervening generations will make sure it gets passed on that way in any case.
Absolutely. At great personal risk, she stopped the guy. Whether or not she fired the fatal shot is a question of academic interest at most.
One of the reasons the mainstream media get away with their agenda-driven lies and distortions is that there are too few in sufficiently powerful positions to call them on the carpet. Thanks to the internet, and talk radio, that is occurring more and more these days (as was most recently evident in the resounding defeat of the 'immigration reform' bill), but the mainstream media are still succeeding in disseminating agenda-driven lies whose results are influencing the minds of the 90%+ uninformed among us ... and, worse, re-writing history. All one has to do is ask the average man on the street about his views on global warming. Rather than telling you that it is a politically-invented power grab, designed to rob our children of their individual liberties, he will launch into a memorized diatribe about how humanity must stop being so globally selfish.
Whether or not Murray committed suicide (and I highly doubt it), the media will spin this tragedy to minimize the role Amass played in the outcome. They will seek to demean her character at every turn, and they will ultimately downplay, if not eliminate, the role that the heroic application of the Second Amendment played in saving the lives of hundreds of Christian worshippers here in America.
As one FReeper wrote yesterday, I guess they [the mainstream media] will never forgive her for stopping what could have been the most news-worthy bloodbath in history! They were probably orgasmic over the thought of hundreds of Christians gunned down in church in America.
As unpalatable as that statement may seem, I do believe that there are some in decision-making positions in the media who feel exactly that way. Their love for their fellow man is too often trumped by their desire for a powerful story and their need to fulfill an obsessive political agenda.
We need to continually hold their feet to the fire, without compromise, whenever a lie or distortion threatens to create history out of whole cloth because, although we will necessarily see to it that those within earshot of us have access to the truth, we must consistently remind ourselves that the majority of Americans do not take the time to ferret it out -- and future young Americans sitting in future history classes cannot survive on a rancid diet of left-leaning lies.
~ joanie
Allegiance and Duty Betrayed
Amen!
It is true that the MSM and their abettors in the DNC and the left, and all too many who would like to call themsleves conservatves, will downplay the clear heroine role that Jeanne played as an inspired Christian woman who sought God's council through fasting andd prayer, received it, and then acted upon it, placing herself, with her firearm where God wanted her and then taking no thought of her own life to confront and defeat this deranged killer.
Her faith, her willingness to act on it, and her understanding of and use of the 2nd amendment are the key stroies here...but are points our internal enemies will ignore and gloss and smooth ove4r.
With that, I go back to my commnets in post 79, because those people amongst us, who oppose the American ideals and foundational principles, do not understand, believe, or count on that same God in Heaven working through the rest of us, even as He did through Jeanne...and therein lies their ultimate defeat:
It is up to each of us, through whatever means are provided by that same Hand of Providence for our disposal, to spread the word of this occurance ourselves.God bless you and yours Joanie. Merry Christmas and the best of the season and the upcoming New Year to you.
That same God in Heaven, our Heavenly Father who heard Jeanne's heartfelt cries for direction, and then provided it to her after her fasting and prayer in such a marvelous way, will not ignore our own cries and appeals...and efforts!
As the Shamnesty proposal went down in flames due to the public cry over it, we can serve as instruments in God's hands in raising the type of awareness this information, this occurance, this witness before God and man, deserves.
Emails, forums, talk shows, cell phones, the internet as a whole...avenues have been opened to us at this time in history precisely, I believe, by that same merciful God, to allow us to circumvent and get around the tyrants and corruption around us as surely as Jeanne's footsteps were guided to circumvent the tyrant that she faced. If we will have and then exhibit the faith that she did, then He will also guide our footsteps and there is no telling what good will come of it.
Warm wishes to you and yours for a blessed Christmas, and a new year filled with contentment and special joys.
~ joanie
So on goes the drumbeat that this is gonna happen. When? After a week, a month or a year, when no one's talking about the story any more? After her inevitable book is at the top of the Amazon charts? After she's been elected to some office?
You're looking for monsters under the bed and threatening a backlash to a phenomenon that simply isn't there.
There is no doubt that jeanne is getting press. But the salient points, particularly those that could lead to an effective front and methodology for combatting this type of crime...namely arming people at the potnetial scenes of these attempts...and her Christian faith leading her to be in that position, are not being covered.
To me, those are the clear messages of this occurance, and an abject contrast to other events, like in Omaha, or Columbine.
Where yoy have had armed citizens present (here, the mall in Utah, the school several years ago in Kentucky) the carnage was halted early on with either a dead perp, or one who surrendered...and far fewer innocent dead. Where you do not have that, the killing usually goes on until the deranged killer is saited and then kills himself.
Just my thoughts.
The media's coverage of this event is every bit as biased as their coverage of everything else. How many times have you heard or seen the heroine's speech where she gives God all the credit for what she did? How many times have you heard reference to the fact that her RKBA saved hundreds of lives? If you've heard either one more than once or twice, you're listening to different media outlets than most of us.
Their spin on what happened in Colorado Springs last weekend is a perfect example of their anti Christian, anti second amendment bias.
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