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To: b_sharp
Are you sure you want to do this?

No, the question is do you. I shan't embarrass you by leading your hand. Here is your statement again.

Abiogensis does not require that a modern cell spontaneously arise, what it does require is an imperfectly self replicating molecule subject to some time consistent selection, even remotely.

Okay.., here.., Take any molecule H2O or any other molecule you might choose, or any imaginary mythical molecule which may have existed in the past. And using your statement there, demonstrate the veracity of your assertion.

Here is a Wikipedia version of the Classic definition

"A chemical reaction is a process that results in the interconversion of chemical substances.[1] The substance or substances initially involved in a chemical reaction are called reactants. Chemical reactions are usually characterized by a chemical change, and they yield one or more products which are, in general, different from the reactants. Classically, chemical reactions encompass changes that strictly involve the motion of electrons in the forming and breaking of chemical bonds, although the general concept of a chemical reaction, in particular the notion of a chemical equation, is applicable to transformations of elementary particles, as well as nuclear reactions"

215 posted on 11/06/2007 11:34:22 PM PST by valkyry1
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To: valkyry1
"Okay.., here.., Take any molecule H2O or any other molecule you might choose, or any imaginary mythical molecule which may have existed in the past. And using your statement there, demonstrate the veracity of your assertion.

"Here is a Wikipedia version of the Classic definition

"A chemical reaction is a process that results in the interconversion of chemical substances.[1] The substance or substances initially involved in a chemical reaction are called reactants. Chemical reactions are usually characterized by a chemical change, and they yield one or more products which are, in general, different from the reactants. Classically, chemical reactions encompass changes that strictly involve the motion of electrons in the forming and breaking of chemical bonds, although the general concept of a chemical reaction, in particular the notion of a chemical equation, is applicable to transformations of elementary particles, as well as nuclear reactions"

I think you are misunderstanding what I said:

Abiogensis does not require that a modern cell spontaneously arise, what it does require is an imperfectly self replicating molecule subject to some time consistent selection, even remotely.

I was not saying that molecules are not produced through chemical reactions, in fact that is and has been my point many times. What I was saying was that the study of abiogenesis does not expect that a complex entity such as a modern cell appeared through spontaneous creation and that claiming it does is the creation of a strawman. What is hypothesized and is currently under research, is that a smaller less complex molecule, which in no way, other than possibly using amino acids, resembles a modern cell, through the processes of self replication and selection passed through many iterations, eventually developed into a modern cell.

This process takes into account and relies on common chemical reactions.

It was the complexity I was arguing against, not the chemistry.

Now, if this isn't your point, please expand on your original statement.

235 posted on 11/07/2007 1:52:03 PM PST by b_sharp ("Science without intelligence is lame, religion without personal integrity is reprehensible"-Sealion)
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