Mitt Romney is a Mormon and I am a Baptist: Get Over It!

Mental illness seems to not be a respector of persons.

Chilling!

Are any of these statements wrong? If so, educate me. Not one is an othodox Christian view.

Do you mind if *I* take a stab at responding to your post?

The Mormon-Evangelical Divide
Beliefs that set Mormons apart, and evangelicals’ response.
By James A. Beverley | posted 2/01/2000 12:00AM
Distinctive LDS Beliefs

God the Father and Jesus appeared to Joseph Smith in 1820, calling him to restore the Church of Christ.
The Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, and Pearl of Great Price constitute sacred scripture, along with the Bible.
The Father (Elohim) is a distinct God from Jesus (the Jehovah of the Old Testament) and the Holy Ghost.
The Godhead is Biblical, and the Trinity is not, see this, and this.
God the Father has a body and has a wife (the Heavenly Mother).
God having a wife is a logical construct. there is no scripture or published doctrine of the church that teaches this, however, it is a common belief.
Jesus is the literal son of the Father (Elohim) and Mary. Some Mormon leaders contend that there was a sexual union between God and Mary.
This has never been taught by Mormon leaders. Mormon doctrine specifically states that Jesus was born of a Virgin, which precludes sex or other similar relations with God or anyone else.
All humans pre-existed as spirits in heaven. Mormon prophets have taught that those who were unfaithful in the spirit world were cursed to be born on earth with black skin.
Mormon prophets have never taught that, it was however a theory from a book called "Mormon Doctrine" by Bruce R McConkie. Later, Bruce R McConkie became a general authority of the Church, but by then that statement had been stricken from his book as inaccurate.
Sacred temple ceremonies were revealed to Joseph Smith, including baptism for the dead and eternal marriage. Mormons can progress to godhood in the next world through following temple endowment rituals. Mormons believe that All men can progress to God hood through the atonement of Jesus Christ, People will be exalted who have never set foot in a temple in mortality.

Evangelical Christian Response

Smith’s false prophecies, occult involvement, anti-biblical theology, and polygamy ruin his credibility as apostle-prophet.
And Jesus' "false prophecies, false miracles, occult involvement, anti-Moses theology, blasphemy, and disrespect for the Law of Moses ruined his credibility as a prophet and savior to many of the phrases in his day.
It is easy to throw out unfounded accusations, but they just don't pan out once investigated, or prayed about.
The Bible alone is the written Word of God. Mormon scriptures contradict clear biblical teaching and cannot be new revelation from God.
Is the Bible complete?
What about Books like The Book of Enoch Which was Quoted in all the Gospels and frequently by the savior himself. The Book of Enoch is also found as part of the Torah in the Dead Sea Scrolls, shouldn't it be part of the Bible? Do you know how something becomes Cannon?
The triune affirmation of the unity of God in three persons remains Christian orthodoxy.
Orthodox means Generally approved, traditional, established.
Mormons do not claim to be orthodox.
Jesus said in John 4 that the Father is a Spirit. The Mormon notion that God has one or more wives is absolute speculation and reflects an anthropomorphic understanding of God.
I have a Body and a spirit. I can be referred to as either, or both, also sometimes as a soul. One does not preclude the other. No where does it say, only a spirit.
The Bible is replete with examples of God having a Body, Jesus for example was the Express Image of God's "Person"
Steven when he was about to be marytered saw "the Son of man standing on the right hand of God."
"The Son of Man" is a direct quote from the Book of Enoch about a messianic prophecy identifying the savior, standing on the right hand of God.
Matthew and Luke teach that Jesus was conceived of the Holy Spirit, and Christian tradition has never interpreted this as a sexual act.
Neither do we.
The Bible nowhere implies that humans pre-exist. Mormon speculations about the curse on black people are rooted in nineteenth-century racist theories believed by early Mormon leaders.
Just a couple of examples, shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? and Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
God is the father of our spirits, God knew us and all we could become before we were even born, Sanctifying some of us, and ordaining some of us, and knowing us. We existed even then as his creations which we will always be.
Mormon temple ceremonies are not biblical in nature and easily lead to works righteousness.
"works righteousness", somebody needs to read James 2:14-26 Mormons see faith and works thusly: Faith leads naturally to works, works (performed righteously) increase faith, which increases Works, etc.
It is a positive reinforcement cycle that increases faith in Jesus Christ, Faith in Jesus, brings us closer to him and allows him to save us with his grace (for no matter what we do, we will never earn heaven, it is a gift form Jesus for those who believe on his name.)

James A. Beverley, professor of theology and ethics at Tyndale Seminary in Toronto.
Now I ask you a question, why doe it matter what James A Beverly thinks of me and my religion, the only judgment that matters is God's, when I stand before the Judgment bar of Christ, he will call some to go to the right and some to the left. No religion guarantees a trip right or left for that is determined by the heart, and that quite frankly no man can judge.

As for if Mormonism can help with that "Heart" thing, there is a quick and easy way to know that exceeds our poor ability to discussant here, and that is to Put our religion to "The Test" By Getting a Book of Mormon (for free) and Getting a Bible for Free Praying about both, and Try the Spirits to see if they are of God. God has Told us toAsk this is not a suggestion, but a command, straight from the Bible to find out direct from him if things are part of his gospel, besides, would you rather trust someone with a degree, or God?

My garbage man wants to be known as a Removal and Recycling Engineer, too.

I would humor him if I was you, he might just change his rout, and you'd be hip deep in trash quickly! (if your kids generate as much as mine...)

LOL!

Grig said "The study was done by a health insurance company, they only looked at their customers and noted their customers in Utah used certain prescriptions at a higher rate than their customers in other states."

OMM said "I must say that I am not aware of any suicides among any congregations I have been a member of in the last 14 years. Of course, I have never been to Utah where the non-members elected Mayor Rocky either!

Even though the following does not address the suicides by religion, with the high mormon population in Utah, there is every possibility that there could be a correlation.

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February-March 2007

5th Annual "Awakening Utah" Walk for Suicide Prevention & Awareness

The Mental Health Association in Utah and Educators Mutual along with several corporate sponsors and community partners are proud to announce the 5th Annual "Awakening Utah" Walk for Suicide Prevention and Awareness 2007. We invited the Utah community to participate in "Awakening Utah" to the prevalence of suicide in our State and how we can prevent this tragedy from happening in the future. This event will take place on Saturday April 28th 2007 from 11:00 AM - 2:00 PM and will include an opening ceremony composed of both suicide survivors and people who have attempted to commit suicide sharing their stories of personal grief and hope. The opening ceremony will take place at the Northwest Pavilion in Sugar House Park and will be followed by a 5K walk through the park . We are expecting approximately 1,000 participants this year.

Approximately every 17 minutes someone will commit suicide in the United States alone, and Utah has the 10th highest suicide rate in the nation according to the America Association of Suicidology. The walk is designed to liberate friends, family and the Utah community from the shame and silent suffering that surrounds suicide. All proceeds from this event will be used to support suicide prevention and intervention programs. For more information please contact The Mental Health Association in Utah at 801-596-3705 or visit our web site at www.xmission.com/~mhaut/.

Organizations providing support for "Awakening Utah" Walk for Suicide Prevention and Awareness included: Educators Mutual, Altius Health Plans, Lilly Inc, Workers Compensation Fund, Select Health Plans, Westminster College, The University of Utah, Utah Libraries Association, Clearfield Jobcorps, The GLBT Center, Utah Birthing Network, The Mental Health Association in Utah's Board of Directors, Caring Connections, Saturn Company, Stop the Stigma, Hugs for Life, Starbucks and Salt Lake Community College.

Sponsors for the Walk

Platinum: Educators Mutual Insurance; Lilly Inc.
Gold: Altius Health Plans.
Silver: Blue Cross Blue Shield
Bronze: Select Health

Facts About Suicide in Utah

Utah is 10th in the Nation in Suicide Rates with 14.1 suicides per 100,000 population.
Suicide Rates in Utah have increased 256% since 1956.
Elderly men over 85 have the highest suicide rates in the Nation and in Utah.
Suicide is the 3rd leading cause of death in Utah for young people (ages 15-19 and 15-24) after homicides and accidents.
In the past 60 years the suicide rate has quadrupled for males between 15-24 and has doubled for females in the same age range.
One in 12 college students have made a suicide plan.
Suicide rates for Native Americans are more than double the National average.
Suicide rates for children between the ages of 10-14 increased 99% between 1980 and 1997.
Utah has a suicide rate that is higher in rural counties and the preferred method of suicide is predominantly firearms.

The Link Between Suicide and Depression

Suicide is the major life threatening complication of depression. People who have a dependence on alcohol or drugs in addition to being depressed are at a greater risk of suicide. Individuals who exhibit the following symptoms are at particular risk for suicide.

Hopelessness
Rage, uncontrolled anger, seeking revenge.
Acting reckless or engaging in risky behaviors, seemingly without thinking.
Feeling trapped-as if there is no way out.
Increasing alcohol or drug use.
Withdrawing from friends, family and society.
Anxiety, agitation, inability to sleep or sleeping all of the time.
Dramatic mood swings.
Expressing no reason for living; no sense of purpose in life.
Giving away personal possessions.

Given the fact that Utah has the highest incidence of clinical depression in the United States, it makes sense to begin looking at the creation of a statewide suicide prevention plan.

Further, it requires a sociological analysis of the culture/cultures that exist in Utah and needs they either meet or don't meet. Self destruction is something that only occurs when people feel they have little or no worth. Self identity does not develop in a vacuum. People learn to feel about themselves in the context of social interaction. So, research needs to be done about the nature of social class, social stratification and social interaction. Then perhaps we can change the culture to become more life affirming.

Executive Director's Report

Our focus continues to be on exploring new dimensions of human understanding and new definitions of mental health. It is a dynamic process because we live in a world where the only constant is change. We are committed to work toward a new sense of community based upon support, love and reciprocity. A community that is non-judgmental. And open to change.

MHAU has recently completed a contract with The Utah State Division of Substance Abuse and Mental Health to collect information and make recommendations about suicide prevention among all of the Five federally recognized Indian Tribes in the State of Utah. This includes Shoshone, Piaute, Dine, Northern Ute and Ghoshute. We traveled to the respective tribal Nations and conducted a series of "Focus" groups in order to see how the State Division could be more helpful. Our recommendations included cultural competence training for state employees; having counselors on reservations and creating a Statewide Native American Mental Health Advisory Board.

MHAU Mission Statement

The Mental Health Association in Utah promotes an expansive definition of mental health and works to improve the care and treatment of persons living with a mental illness through public policy and public education!

MHAU Board of Directors:

James Magleby/LCSW/President

Carl Brown, C.P.A. Secretary

Lilli DeCair, Holistic Health Consultant

Carol Kelly/ Consultant/Teacher

Mark Holland, Financial Advisor

Rob Miller/ Consultant

Melissa Scott/Administration Data Entry

Carolyn de las Casas IHC

Ken Gillette/ IHC

Honorary Board Members:

James Ferguson M.D., Radiant Technologies

Forrest Cuch, Director, Utah State Division of Indian Affairs

Lissa Martin, Morris Travel

Mack D. Gift Ph.D., Executive Director

Staff

Angie Lewis, Executive Assistant Link Description

Deb Hinich, Bookkeeper Mental Health Association in Utah

The Mormonism adherent has an heretical rut in the mind that affirms Satan’s lie that humans can become gods, so the difference is impossible for Mormonism adherents to grasp because they want with all their heart to believe ’become as one of us’ means become gods, when it is plain that God said ‘become as one of us‘ means to know good and evil, not become gods. Angels know good and evil, yet they are not gods. But such a simple syllogism is beyond the Mormonism adherent's keen.

Spelling police here, it's ken, not keen. Just a warning this time, but watch it or people will start to think you think Mormons are "keen" and we all don't want that, do we?"

Hey, who let them in here!

I ask a simple questions to you, will Satan tell you a truth to get you to believe a lie? Yes, or No?
If yes, since he lied about something here to Eve, he is still a liar.
You said "when it is plain that God said ‘become as one of us‘ means to know good and evil, not become gods" I never said that, just that Satan did not lie by telling Eve she could become as God knowing Good and evil, that's all.

The original point that was postulated is that Satan lied to people to tell them the could become Gods, and that is not what he said (the knowing Good and evil part got left off) and what he promised actually came true.

MHG, I think you believe yourself to be an honorable person, trace this thread of comments back and see if I am telling the truth, then report on it, please, I await your careful analysis.

DU

Going to aTrunk or Treat, BBL8R**********************

Thank you foxxy,

Your post could actually be a lifesaver for some of our more “depressed” freepers who are in need of the information about where to get help.

Jesus Christ saves. Knowing He has redeemed you of your sin, and your hopelessness is what saved me from the overwhelming burdens of being a Mormon woman and mother of five, with the necessity to work full time, while still upholding the pressures to perform perfectly.

Of course not all Mormon women experienced the stresses that I lived under, but many of them do.

See what I mean, Elsie, the poster is a prime example of one unable to see that he offered the ‘blue’ quote from Satan as the true part and the red as the lie part, yet the blue the poster highlighted from Satan is also a lie, but because of the Mormonism blind spot the poster cannot comprehend his own error. [Fortunately, he can at least see a spelling mistake where tired fingers add an “e” that is out of place.]

[Fortunately, he can at least see a spelling mistake where tired fingers add an “e” that is out of place.]

Gotta have those priorities, right?

It’s called tough love. By the way, I’m still waiting for that the BYU profess who “is teaching” a class at BYU where he/she is teaching the same liberal principles as other liberal professors on other campuses. Haven’t you had enough time to dig around the internet to try to find some dirt to justify your lie?

LOL. Just another anti “lying for the Lord.”

Hey, if you will go back in the posts, I'M not the one who posted that I knew that liberal prof at BYU...I just posted the info on ONE of them that was there and is no longer.

Posted by to ComeUpHigher
On 10/30/2007 4:26:09 PM MDT ·

You’ve probably never even been on the campus...

I was laying my head on a BYU dorm pillow well before you even knew your daughter. I certainly know how conservative BYU students were at least once upon a time. But I'll concede that these days no doubt your campus pulse is better than mine.

Please be specific. Identify this professor and what he supposedly is teaching that is “typical of what liberal profs are teaching nationwide.” I find this assertion particularly suspect.

No. I won't give this prof an ever-widening platform for his liberal tenets. And it's not like he hasn't already been public with what he's pushing (I don't have any "inside" knowledge on him). It's not like the BYU admin folks aren't aware of concerns (they are). I frankly think the problem will correct itself, because I think you & I can actually agree that the main core of BYU is still conservative, and that conservative element will win out.

(There isn't it nice when we can actually agree on something?)

Haven’t you had enough time to dig around the internet to try to find some dirt to justify your lie?
LOL. Just another anti “lying for the Lord.”

I can't help it if there is SO much "anti" information out there to find...and being called "anti" suits me just fine.

....is having an affair,....was having an affair...

...is teaching at BYU, ....was teaching at BYU.

It doesn't really matter to anyone but those who want to split hairs. The guy is a wacko, and was employed as a professor at BYU when he made his wacko anti-American allegations.

I wouldn't call it lying, I'd call it reading some outdated information. Of course, unless one is current on exactly who has been excommunicated, fired, quit, or disfellowshipped or otherwise shunned, it is an easy thing for it to slip notice. Harmless mistake, IMHO - - and a lie in yours. Big deal.

Riiiggght. The anonymous professor-—or the professor who will not be named-—is proof of the identity of the liberal BYU professor and what he/she “is teaching.”

In my profession that kind of assertion results in a finding of contempt by the court and the impostion of sanctions.

In the anti-Mormon profession that assertion is conclusive proof of their claim. Thanks for the laugh.

Clinton and Greyfoxx39: “It all depends upon what your definition of ‘is’ is.” Thanks for the lesson in prevarication. I think you’ve got it mastered.

Isn’t “harkin” a Dim-Dhimmi-Dem from Iowa??

Hunter is going no place. Romney has a strategy that might work. He plans to win IA and NH plus MI, where is used to live. He feels that the momentum of those first three wins would be enough to push him over the top on Super Tuesday, particularly in the South where he leads in SC and NC. After Super Tuesday, it’s all over. He’s got money, he’s got great organization in those early states. Might work.

In my profession that kind of assertion results in a finding of contempt by the court and the impostion of sanctions.

Your profession is rated lower than used car salesman..I can see why. Talk to Colofornian about the professor...your OCD is getting tedious.

MY OCD? LOL. It’s your anti-Mormon OCD that is tedious.