Romney Surges in S.C., Florida

Dry Fly Politics ^ | 10/23/07 | Steve

[Reaganesque]

Tuesday, October 23rd, 2007...8:57 am

Romney Surges in S.C., Florida

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In vastly underreported election news, recent polls are showing a Romney surge in both South Carolina and Florida. Of course no one knows this because no one has mentioned it. We would all think that Romney was flopping around like a fish out of water in the Southern states according to some recent posts that have been written about each state. Of course, logic would tell us that Romney should not be doing well in either of these states: He is Mormon, Slick, and a NorEaster. Nevertheless, he is polling well and will likely be right in the thick of the races come January. Here are the recent polls:

South Carolina

Oct 02, Insider Advantage Poll: Thompson 21%, Romney and Giuliani 16%

Sep 26-29, ARG Poll: Romney 26%, Giuliani 23%, Thompson 10%

Sep 26-27, Rasmussen: Thompson 24%, Giuliani 20%, Romney 15%

Additionally, the Romney campaign performed an internal poll, here are the results:

Romney Internal Poll: Thompson: 24%, Romney 20%, Giuliani 15%

So, in South Carolina Romney is right in the thick of the fight. It appears that the recent condemnation of Giuliani by Christian Right leaders is having a detrimental effect and that the advertising that Romney has been airing over the last month is causing some movement. However, it should be noted that the same article that reported the Romney internal poll caveats the results by saying that this was before the Bob Jones endorsement. A separat poll says that 27% of South Carolinans are more likely to support Romney due to this, but 32% are less likely. It will be interesting to see what effect the evangelical endorsements will have.

In Florida, Romney also continues to surge, and Florida is arguably more important a victory for any of the candidates. Here are the recent polls:

Oct 1-8, Quinnipiac: Giuliani: 27%, Thompson 19%, Romney 17%

Oct. 2, Insider Advantage: Giuliani 29%, Thompson 19%, Romney 16%

Granted, these polls are nothing to get thrilled over as Giuliani has a sizeable lead. However, all previous polling had Romney hovering between 7% and 10% in Florida. So a 6-7 point jump in a month is significant and he is really the only one gaining steam in these states, whereas Giuliani and Thompson are plateauing.

It should also be mentioned that all the hubub about Huckabee or Thompson surging against Romney in Iowa should be somewhat muted by the most recent Iowa poll that gave Romney an impressive 14 point lead:

Oct 10-14, Strategic Vision Poll: Romney-27, Giuliani-13, Huckabee-12, Thompson-10.

I wonder if this will get the coverage that the poll placing Huckabee within 6 points will get. I doubt it.

All in all, while Romney has stalled in some places, so have all the candidates. The race is a real crap shoot, there is far from a difinitive front runner. However, it still looks to be a Giuliani-Romney finale.

[restornu]

When you are contented in your own faith MHGinTN, than you will stop trying to tear down others to feel comfortable!

And that is a truism!

[MHGinTN]

Eternal destiny in doubt is not about 'comfort', mine or yours. You think being called a religious bigot by people who lie and deceive and claim to be the only true restored Christianity is comfortable for we opposing Mormonism? Do you presume that being concerned for your eternal destiny makes me comfortable?... When the evidence of Mormonism Apologists' posts shows you folks are in need of Jesus rather than working so much to undermine His Grace, His Salvation by Faith? Are you often delusional?

BTW, how did your surgery go, Resty? We were praying for you Wednesday. I see you came through it without losing any of your fustiness.

[restornu]

you are not new others had that idea before you!:)LOL

I was ready for of the word of the Lord for the Bible told me so but it was nowhere to be found, because it was with the line of Joseph which is the Book of Mormon which is a record of the descendants of Joseph.

[restornu]

Contentment in ones faith comes from the Lord and what goes on around you really has no effect on your personal relationship of the creator.

Meaning the desire to be combative for the heck of it, will not exist unless one goes out of their way to berate you endlessly.

[greyfoxx39]

I was aware when they suck out the old stuff and sight went from white to black and than smokey negative until they put the patch on.

YUK! I need to have mine done and I DON'T want to be awake. I bet I don't have a choice though. Keep us posted on your progress, resty...glad it was successful and you are going to be much better. ;) BTW just WHAT is a "fun operation"?

[colorcountry]

Glad to hear the operation went well. I pray your eyesight will be restored good as new.

BTW, I have a treat for you on my homepage. My GENEOLOGY....see what a good little Mormon gal I am/was, have been...lol

[Reno232]

I really don’t have time for this, but I was going to do research on this post later until I did just one search on just one of your quotes. Journal of Discources vol.2 page 171 “LORD DID NOT COME TO JOSEPH SMITH, BUT SENT HIS ANGEL TO INFORM HIM THAT HE SHOULD NOT JOIN ANY RELIGIOUS SECT OF THE DAY, FOR THEY WERE ALL WRONG...”

For those of you reading this, let me give you the REAL quote:

“But He did send His angel to this same obscure person, Joseph Smith Jun., who afterwards became a Prophet, Seer, and Revelator, and informed him that he should not join any of the religious sects of the day, for they were all wrong; that they were following the precepts of men instead of the Lord Jesus; that He had a work for him to perform, inasmuch as he should prove faithful before Him”.

Now first of all, notice the difference in the QUOTE I referenced & the one MHG referenced which does not exist! I can only presume he had it in quotes b/c he got it off some anti site & assumed it was right & a quote. It was not, surprise, surprise. Next, I would reference you to the use of commas in the real quote, thus breaking up the sentence & indicating it was the Lord who was speaking to Joseph Smith, the angel just being another factor in the sentence.

Now, I don’t know if this is MHG being deceitful or whether he was just duped by those who did write this garbage, but either way, it was deceitful. I suspect strongly the rest of the post probably came from the same place, therefore the credibility is zero.

I was going to research the rest of the areas addressed later, but then I thought, why? Just so that I can spend all this effort unmasking this charade & then have MHG come back w/ another drive-by later & go through it all over again? He posts, we refute w/ evidence such as I just did, he leaves, & comes back & does it time & time again.

When you want to have a reasoned discussion, let me know & I’d be glad to discuss. But if you’re going to continue on this deceitful track, the sandbox will be all yours.

[mission9]

This little skirmish with the anti-mormon kooks has given me an idea. George W. Bush’s success has been prepared for by prayer teams who daily hold up the Presidency and this nation. We need to do as much and more for Mitt.

You can help. Please encourage your local Romney field manager to compile a list of local Ministers who have felt led in their spirit to help Mitt. If they have not can you start on such a list?

I would like to organize a prayer Breakfast on behalf of Mitt and invite local leaders of faith, it should be ecumenical, and, if possible, include Hindus and Islamists, if they should be led by a prompting of their inner voice to come.

A series of these prayer events would be the precursor to a national prayer breakfast led by Gov. Romney via satellite simulcast. New communications tools available from Google and youtube make such events cheaper and easier than ever before. In my judgment, only the Romney Team has the combination of vision, talent, and resources to make such an event possible.

I am not ashamed of my faith, and I am not ashamed to ask you to help get this going. Remember, this is a National campaign, but all politics is local.

I earnestly believe that Mitt is a compelling leader that will attract individuals of all faiths in a common goal to unite and make fast our prosperity and our union.

If I could only share with you all the specific times that praying for George Bush and this Nation during these recent years of strife, has blessed me and my family beyond measure, you would not have the time to do any thing else for weeks. But this is not our challenge, our challenge is the future. Our challenge is the next eight years.

I cannot emphasize to you strongly enough that while the fate of Governor Romney is the focus of my prayers, it is not for him that I pray, but for my nation.

It is so amazing to me that a candidate of Mitt’s qualities, his poise, his executive abilities, his proven track record, his wealth, would lay all of these things down, and literally put his life and his family lives and fortune on the line for the sake of this nation. It so greatly pains me to say this, but this campaign trail has the stench of a suicide mission, not just for Mitt but every candidate. We are soon to enter a phase of the campaign process in which metal detectors and limited access will be necessary. That is why these personal events are so crucial now, and the use of these personal events to establish a pattern of televised meetings that are genuine and warm when personal contact is impossible.

And as amazing as this is, it is more amazing that our country is in such a fragmented and selfish place that such a man as Mitt is not readily embraced. The complaint that I hear is that, “he is too perfect.” Mitt is a man, he to, is imperfect and flawed, only spiritual energy can perfect his flaws, hold evil in abeyance, awaken this Nation to his fitness to unite us, and lead us.

[Reno232]

Just for giggles, I wanted to see if my theory about the rest of this post was correct. My next bit of research, Journal of Discourses Vol. 6 page 29. This time he a least got the quote right but completely obliterated the context.

“Do you suppose that God in person called upon Joseph Smith, our Prophet? God called upon him; but God did not come himself and call, but he sent Peter to do it. Do you not see? He sent Peter and sent Moroni to Joseph, and told him that he had got the plates. Did God come himself? No: he sent Moroni and told him there was a record, and says he, “That record is matter that pertains to the Lamanites, and it tells when their fathers came out of Jerusalem, and how they came, and all about it; and, says he, “If you will do as I tell you, I will confer a gift upon you.”

Now, was this an account of the first vision, or was he talking about the fact that the Lord sent Moroni in His stead to talk about the BOM, etc.? Joseph never claimed the Lord showed him where the BOM was. It was Moroni.

That’s 2 for 2 my friend. I’ll go no further cause I know what the results will be. I’m sure you think you’re doing the Lord’s work here, but even if you’re correct in your beliefs, who’s gonna believe you when you pull this stuff?

Credibility, Zero. You can be better than that MHG. You can make your case w/o the distortions & deceit. I really believe you can. Others here have made strong arguments for you side w/o doing what you’ve done. You’re not the only one, you have company. Perhaps you should hang out w/ the more credible ones & learn from them.

For now, I’m done w/ you though. I’m taking my wife out to dinner. Have a great weekend all, you too MHG.

[Grig]

“I was going to do research on this post later..”

You would be duplicating a lot of work already available online if you did..

http://en.fairmormon.org/First_Vision_accounts#Specific_First_Vision_issues

These guys take making someone an offender for a word to a whole new level. There is no allowance for the fact no verbal or written account of any event will have every detail in it, or that when people describe some event from their life at different times, to different audiences, for different reasons, that they will naturally include or exclude or abbreviate the account to keep the focus on the aspects of it relevant to the conversation.

It is a total lack of charity on their part to act like this. Their own accounts of events from their own lives would show the same kind of irrelevant variation in details and even minor contradictions if put under the same kind of microscope. Certainly we can see that when we compare the 4 gospels, or when we compare the various accounts the apostle Paul gave of his vision.

[Reno232]

If they want to debate the point, then fine. It’s the deceitfulness I can’t stand. Apparently, there’s no shame or level they won't stoop to in anti-mormonville. And there are ex-members that call us liars, sheesh.

[Osage Orange]

Mitt will be on "Mad Money" with Cramer tonight at 6 and 11PM EST on CNBC.

Oh great.....Cramer the stock manipulator..with Mr. Romney the flip-flopper.

Cramer's record is very suspect...as you should know.

Cramer has very little respect with professionals.

[MHGinTN]

Bwahahaha, so did Jesus and God the Father appear or the messenger (singular)?

[MHGinTN]

Bwahahaha, that's even more outrageous (chuckle, chuckle) ... you've just shown that Joe Smith was consulting with familiar spirits. Sent Peter, the man, the Apostle who was crucified unside down? Are you aware that the OLD TESTAMENT forbids consulting the dead? (Grin)Or are you now trying to equate Joe with Jesus? Pitiful.

I posted that I would not exchange with Delphi User or any of his incarnations, so I guess it's time to stop exchanging with you too.

I it amazing how far into the realm of the irrational the Mormonism apologists will go in order to defend the lying, adulterous, false prophet named Joseph Smith.

[Spacetrucker]

My only problem with Mitt is his ease at changing positions he held quite readily while Governor of Massachusetts. I was leaning Huckabee, but having got myself more up-to-date on his true colors he is only conservative on abortion and gun rights - the rest he seems to be a bit left of Bush. I believe Romney could get the nod from the rest of the prominent Christian Coalition members, but let’s see if they soften on him.

[Grig]

“you’ve just shown that Joe Smith was consulting with familiar spirits. Sent Peter, the man, the Apostle who was crucified unside down? Are you aware that the OLD TESTAMENT forbids consulting the dead?”

Peter, James, John and Christ all saw Moses on the mount of transfiguration. Christ and Moses had a chat even. You can read about the death of Moses in Deut 34.

There is a big difference between seeking out the dead on your own initiative, and God sending one of his servants to you.

Also, it was a resurrected Peter who came to Joseph, so he was not dead.

[sandude]

I have a treat for you on my homepage. My GENEOLOGY....

We are cousins. Distant but related. Cheers

[Tall_Texan]

You do realize that Mitt is a "lay" minister don't you? He in fact has been a Stake President (which is said to be equivalent to a diocese in Catholicism .)

My Mormon sister brought this up to me and says she is troubled by Romney's positions while running/ruling Massachusetts compared to the LDS Church's teachings. She would have no problem if Romney had stuck to Mormon doctrine in running for office but, apparently, he steered quite away from it which alarms her because she says nobody should reach the level of Stake president and not be solid in the church's positions.

While not a Mormon, I would feel better about Romney if he had been a strict Mormon than what he seems to be which is a political chameleon.

[colorcountry]

Which branch?

[restornu]

I had a good time all the way through it I call it fun because you are part of it and I did not feel a thing for me anyway it was amazing to witness it all.