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To: NYer

Not to be too picky, but my personal belief is that Jerry Falwell was not an evangelical in the sense that most people think of today. When reporters report on “evangelicals,” they are usually referring to non-denominational churches such as Rick Warren’s and the like. Falwell had a denoimination, Baptist, and they have a defined orthodoxy, as opposed to non-denominational evangelicals, who seem to invent their own orthodoxy on a church by church basis (I know, since I belong to one).

Of course, in the traditional sense, Falwell was an evangelist (someone who is spreading the Word), but I don’t think he was a typical non-denominational evangelist a la Rick Warren, Robert Schuller, and other megachurch founder,as well as my own current quasi-denomination, The Vineyard.

Of course, it is too much to expect the media to get anything right regarding religion, but I think they miss the point when they classify him as an evangelical along the lines of Rick Warren and the like. I have seen several websites from the Baptists who are quite opposed to Warren, and even argue that these types of churches are not “authentic Christians,” in that they do not follow the core message of sin and salvation through grace.


21 posted on 05/22/2007 8:07:32 AM PDT by Fractal Trader
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To: Fractal Trader
"When reporters report on “evangelicals,” they are usually referring to non-denominational churches such as Rick Warren’s and the like."

If reporters think that, they are sadly mistaken. On the other hand, I wouldn't expect a reporter to understand what an Evangelical is! The term "Evangelical" merely identifies a person as endorsing the Gospel of Jesus Christ. All organized "born-again" churches are Evangelicals.

26 posted on 05/22/2007 8:14:34 AM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: Fractal Trader

The main problem is that the “evangelicals” tend to take a “by any means necessary” approach to outreach. It’s all a numbers game to them.

The Bible says the way is narrow and few will find it. Few will find it because few will preach it.


29 posted on 05/22/2007 8:17:03 AM PDT by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: Fractal Trader

“I have seen several websites from the Baptists who are quite opposed to Warren, and even argue that these types of churches are not “authentic Christians,” in that they do not follow the core message of sin and salvation through grace.”

1) Those Baptist would be wrong about Rick Warren.
2) Rick Warren (while he doesn’t use the baptist moniker) is a Baptist. He was trained as a Southern Baptist, and his methods are widely Taught in Southern Baptist Seminaries, especially in their missions classes. I know because I am such a student.
3) Rick Warren uses a different method to present salvation through grace, and repentance of sin, that do traditional churches, but it is the salvation message the bible gives.

Now I realize Rick Warren is not a 5 point Calvinist, but then anyone who actually knows any Greek can’t be and be honest, just means he knows his bible.

I don’t agree with everything Rick Warren does, but I am not going to malign someone who is getting the word out.

Evangelical isn’t a Denomination, but being in a Denomination doesn’t preclude you from being evangelical.

To be called an evangelical you need to Preach This:

1Co 15:1 Now I want to make clear for you, brothers and sisters, the gospel that I preached to you, that you received and on which you stand,
1Co 15:2 and by which you are being saved, if you hold firmly to the message I preached to you — unless you believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I passed on to you as of first importance what I also received — that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures,
1Co 15:4 and that he was buried, and that he was raised on the third day according to the scriptures,
1Co 15:5 and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.
1Co 15:6 Then he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep.
1Co 15:7 Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles.
1Co 15:8 Last of all, as though to one born at the wrong time, he appeared to me also.
1Co 15:9 For I am the least of the apostles, unworthy to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.
1Co 15:10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me has not been in vain. In fact, I worked harder than all of them — yet not I, but the grace of God with me.
1Co 15:11 Whether then it was I or they, this is the way we preach and this is the way you believed.

If that is your message of salvation you are evangelical, denomination or not.


36 posted on 05/22/2007 8:26:37 AM PDT by viper592
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To: Fractal Trader
The fact is that Saddleback Church, Rick Warren, Pastor is affiliated with the Southern Baptist Convention.
47 posted on 05/22/2007 8:53:09 AM PDT by Coldwater Creek
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To: Fractal Trader
      Actually, Dr. Falwell was not an evangelist, but a pastor.  He was not an evangelical, but a fundamentalist. 

      It seems to me that the mainstream media (who are basically clueless when it comes to reporting on anything about Christianity) use "evangelical" to refer to anybody outside of the "mainstream protestant" or Roman churches. 

      Dr. Falwell was, of course, a strong proponent of evangelism, but from a fundamentalist point of view, an evangelical is at least in agreement with the National Association of Evangelicals, who are regarded as somewhat weak on issues such as inerrancy and inspiration.  While Dr. Falwell has always been a Baptist, he did not affiliate with the SBC until about 10 years ago.

      Dr. Falwell will be sorely missed, but Thomas Road Baptist Church, Liberty University, and his other ministries will continue. 

66 posted on 05/22/2007 10:11:55 AM PDT by Celtman (It's never right to do wrong to do right.)
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To: Fractal Trader

Pretty good explanation - except I think that Thomas Road is an Independent Baptist - not Southern Baptist as Page.

Independent’s aren’t really a “denomination” as such .. though the Southern Baptist Convention is a VERY loose denomination where local churches have a LOT automony..

I’ve been a member of both - the Independent are very much unto their own.. no one over riding Association.


104 posted on 05/23/2007 9:09:32 PM PDT by pamlet
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