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To: Cincinna

“If you add up all the taxes in France, income tax, social charges, TVA, and a tax on everything you possess for people having a new worth over $75,000, including their home, taxes are over 60% for middle class working people.”

The wealth tax on fortunes hits above 750,000 Euros, which is to say about $1 million, not $75,000. Anyway, wealth taxes are the way to go. Eliminate the income tax, the sales tax and other taxes that burden the active economy which creates all the jobs. Eliminate capital gains and dividends taxes. Just tax absolute wealth, at a flat rate. That is definitely the fairest and least distorting tax of all.

But yes, if you add up taxes in France, it is about 60%. But remember what you are getting for that 60%! You are getting medical insurance, a pension, and a free college education, not to mention a clean and swift transport system and electrical energy self-sufficiency.

In America, the average middle class person spends about 36% of his income on taxes. But when you add in the cost of medical insurance and pension savings, and college education costs and savings, these total costs add up to about 67% of the American’s paycheck.

So yes, in France the taxes are higher, no doubt about it. BUT the overall person pays a lot less in the aggregate for the same bundle of services (government + health insurance + retirement security + college education) than Americans do.

Big insurance pools for necessary things (like medicine, pensions and education) should be paid for through a single-payer state system. The French way of doing it is more economically efficient for French families than the American way. To put it plainly, after the cost of government, medical insurance, education and pension savings, the French family has 45% of their income left. After paying for the same costs: government, medical insurance, education and pension savings, the American family has only 33% of its income left. Which means, to me, that the French way of doing it is more economically efficient, especially given that wages are lower in France, so it’s 55% of a significantly lower salary that provides services as good as what the Americans get for 67% of their much higher salaries. I think that, over time, American companies are buckling under the American model and are going to force French-style public pensions and health insurance on the American government. The American way of doing it is unsustainable.

France is through the worst of it economically. The French economy is growing steadily, and French unemployment is slowly but steadily shrinking. So, France will keep its model, because it works better that you seem to think. I predict, in fact, that America will be forced by economic reality (of spending far more per capita to do the same things) towards the French single-payer model.


42 posted on 04/27/2007 6:06:01 PM PDT by Vicomte13 (Le chien aboie; la caravane passe.)
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To: Vicomte13

Class warfare, tax the rich. That is the class warfare crap that usually comes out of Democrats, not Conservatives.

The wealth tax in France is a YEARLY tax on your total net worth including your home. If you have a decent apartment in Paris normally worth more that 750,000 Euros you are taxed every year, on top of real estate taxes and other assorted taxes. Then you are taxed again on everything when you die. It is a confiscatory tax system that is designed to redistribute wealth, even before it is created.

The transportation system in France is not free. The trains are excellent. though very expensive. The Metro, the equivalent of our Subway system is less efficient, doesn’t run all night, is definitely not free, in fact it is more expensive than the NYC Subway system.

NYC has an almost free education system from kindergarten through graduate school.

There is no University in France that is free that compares to the high quality of higher education in the US which is why all the French who can afford it, from Socialists like Dominique Strauss-Kahn on up send their own children to school in the States.

Same for the medical care.

I come from a family with many many doctors. They all treat many Europeans, particularly people from France. The French people who can afford it come here for major health issues. The same for dentists. The “free” dentists in France are worth exactly that... nothing. The free market dentists are excellent, and most of them have trained in Dental Schools in the US. They charge about the same as dentists here.

Why do you continually mislead people here into believing that France is some kind of social paradise, if only the Muslims would go away? The French themselves don’t believe that for a second. They know their system is bloated, outdated, and in need of massive reform and change. The high income earners and professional people are leaving France in record numbers to earn more and have more opportunity for advancement.

The stupid French retirement system of forced retirement that you so highly praise has forced people like Dr. Luc Montaignier, the discoverer of the AIDS virus, to move to the US and work and teach in an American University (Queens College, part of the NYC University system) because the French system refused to employ him after he turned 65. Four out of the last 6 French Nobel prized were awarded to French living and working in the US.

If it weren’t for the Muslim question, would you be in the Socialist camp?


47 posted on 04/27/2007 9:42:51 PM PDT by Cincinna (HILLARY & HER HINO "We are going to take things away from you for the Common Good")
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