Giuliani campaigns in Newport Beach (and outlines his positions)

Daily PIlot ^ | March 24, 2007 | Amanda Pennington and Alicia Robinson

[FairOpinion]

Former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani led off with his strongest card, his terrorism-fighting credentials, before touching on healthcare, immigration and energy policy in a speech to a welcoming crowd Saturday.

"Sept. 11, 2001, taught me — and I believe it taught a lot of people, including President Bush — that we have to remain on offense," Giuliani said. "That means that we have to use our military. We can't show weakness."

Giuliani seemed to hit all the right notes Saturday, getting applause when he criticized Democrats' stance on healthcare and advocated vouchers for schools.

On immigration, he told reporters he doesn't support amnesty for illegal immigrants, but he could support a guest worker program if there were adequate border security and tamper-proof ID cards. He said that even if illegal immigrants "can demonstrate that they are lawful, that they are paying taxes [and] that they'll pay penalties," they still shouldn't be put ahead of people who go through legal channels.

"And citizenship here, if it's earned, should be premised on being able to read and write English and understand American history, so we restore assimilation to the process of immigration," he said.

"Nothing will unite the Republicans more than a candidate who can beat Hillary Clinton," Curry said.

[dforest]

We are talking Arnold, not a conservative.

Now he is a full blown liberal pretending to be a uniter.

Its a joke. Cal-lee -for-nia is not an all America view.

The 2006 loss was because all pubbies were punished for not being conservatives. Spending like drunken sailors and caving to RATs. The libs didn't win by a landslide. They were close. Pubbies punished pubbies and a Rudy candidacy will be a replay of 2006.

[Mr. Silverback]

Yes, it is Cali...that's why I kept telling the McClintock supporters they were wrong about his ability to win. But Cali is not the U.S.A., it's just one state, one that's to the left of a lot of our states.

BTW, here's a handy illustration about the abortion issue in relation to Rudy: Arnold is a pro-choicer, right? In fact, Arnold's abortion views are very similar to Rudy's--it's a tragedy, I'm pro-choice but not rabidly so, etc.

Cruz Bustemente was pro-choice too. And who did Planned Parenthood and every other pro-abort organization support? Cruz Bustemente.

Similarly, people who decide their vote based on abortion will not vote for Rudy over Hillary or Obama.

[Mr. Silverback]

Ignorant is not an insult, or a belittlement. The bottom line is that you were operating on a picture of the situation that was formed without the available facts. That's what ignorance is.

Do you dispute any of the facts I presented in that post?

[beansox]

Well I guess thats why we differ in our opinion about how the general elction will play out.

I think what happened in Cali with Arnold is the changing of tides, and you think its an anomoly.

One of is right. We shall see.

[beansox]

LOL~ Ignorant is an insult no matter how much sugar you put on it. ;)

[dforest]

Conservatives don't get witchy. They use facts. No need to shut down. The paper is in front of you.

If you don't go for Rudy, Hillary is in. Right? No matter if Hill and Bill share his views. Or....even Arnold the Uniter.

[Mr. Silverback]

Sorry to belabor the point, but if you're right, you will be right in spite of the facts, and if I'm right I'll be right because I looked at them and evaluated them with an open mind.

Serious question: Why can't a guy who has similar positions to Reagan win a national election?

[beansox]

"Conservatives don't get witchy."

In the least two weeks I have had my age, my gender, my intelligence, my class, and even my personal life, attacked by Duncan Hunter supporters. I was called a murderer by these "conservatives". These "conservatives" wrote the admin, in an attempt to get me banned, and told them that I was a "troll", after having been a member of this site for 4 years, fighting the good fight along side everyone else. They are still trying to get me banned this on this very thread. All because I am a Rudy Supporter.

Conservatives do indeed get witchy.


The tactics people are using against me, dont scare me, and they dont weaken my resolve. In fact its having the opposite effect. And yes, it does shut me down. After being treated that way, its hard for me to see past it to even hear their candidates message.



I am voting for the GOP ticket. I hope the GOP puts up a candidate that can win. Right now, I believe that candidate to be Rudy. I have an excitement for him that I do not feel towards any other politician, George W Bush aside.

[beansox]

"Why can't a guy who has similar positions to Reagan win a national election?"


Bush Fatigue.

I love Bush, I really do, he is what keeps me coming back. I get emotional about him and I hate what the liberals (and even some scum bags in our own party) and MSM have done to him. I have always repsected Rudy for standing with him in some of the most undeserved darkest times I have ever seen a good man like Bush go through. When so many of our piss poor back stabbing congressman and senators have grandstanded at his expense, Rudy has always stood by him. For that.. I will in turn stand by him.

I feel that the democrats know they cant qualify for POTUS unless they lower the qualifications to their standards. I think they have accomplshed this. I think they lowered the bar. I think that a Reagan type candidadte will be viewed as too far right of that bar to "sheeple".

[Mr. Silverback]

Well, the problem is that it's the truth. You have shown yourself to be mainly ignorant about how people vote in American elections.

One time I was on a flight to Puerto Rico aboard an Air Force KC-135 tanker jet. When we approached for landing, I was in the boom pod (where the refuelling is done) because the boom operator's windows offer a spectacular view. Technically this was a safety violation, because the boom operator's position would do little to protect someone in a crash. I was supposed to be buckled into a troop seat, but KC-135s had a great safety record and she was my bird, Temporary Setback, so I knew she was in great shape. The view was awesome.

Just after we touched down, a voice cried out in my headphones "Abort! ABORT!" Someone was signalling that the landing was going horribly wrong. My stomach turned and my muscles tensed to iron...I knew that if we were in a real crash, I would be surrounded by tanks full of jet fuel vapor, and it would almost certainly turn into a ball of fire and cook me. The landing felt normal, but maybe there was something else wrong, maybe another plane had strayed onto the runway and we were about to collide and die. I dared not get up and run to a proper seat, because as bad as the boom pod was, I was sure that standing up during a crash would be certain death.

I waited, frozen, for soemthing to happen. Why wasn't anyone saying anything? Why wasn't the pilot pushing the throttles up and getting off the runway? We have 44,000 pounds of thrust and we're just sitting here with the throttles at idle? What is going on?

The silence continued even as the brakes were activated and we began to slow. Finally, a cool, but definitely annoyed voice said, "Why did you do that?" It was the aircraft commander.

"Um...sorry, It looked like we were angled and I was sure we were going to go off the runway." It was the navigator, and boy was he sheepish!

The two pilots knew that Temporary Setback was doing fine, going down the runway straight as an arrow after one of the most gentle touchdowns I've ever experienced. Even if they couldn't have seen the runway because of fog or torrential rain, their instruments would have told them so. The navigator had a skewed view of a patch of land and sky, and he saw something that wasn't true. He was trying to save our lives, but he was calling out a warning for a danger that didn't exist, because he was ignorant of the true situation. And I, because I was ignorant back in the boom pod, was scared out of my bloody mind while I was as safe as in my mother's arms.

We are conservatives. we need to operate on facts, not fear.

[KATIE-O]

True. Elections can be a study. If the dems don't offer a liberal enough candidate, some of them will vote green or socialist party. If republicans don't offer a properly conservative candidate, they say they will just stay home. So the swing voters decide - the ones that aren't "wired into politics." And if each party ends up nominating candidates that fit their respective agendas perfectly, it still comes down to swing voters. If Ronald Reagan could come back and run again we'd all be delighted. But he can't, and the world isn't what it was back then. We've had 9/11, and up-and-coming generations of younger voters that are not as concerned about certain social issues as their parents and grandparents. Rudy has stated clearly that he would appoint justices like Roberts and Alito - knowing how they interpret Roe v. Wade. He may not get the nom, and if we field an electable candidate, that will all be good. But he has a lot of appeal to the non-idealogic voter.





Excellent points. You are right, IMO.

[Mr. Silverback]

I think that a Reagan type candidadte will be viewed as too far right of that bar to "sheeple".

We haven't tried a Reagan candidate since 1984. I think much of the Bush fatigue is caused by his lack of conservatism.

Yeah, Rudy has stood by the President, and that's why I like Rudy very much as a person. But conservatism--Reagan conservatism--wins every time it's tried except in those poskets of the country that will be blue no matter what. There's no reason to jump out of the plane just yet.

[wagglebee]

Right now there is such a gap between those ideologies that building a bridge is quite the task.

There is NO GAP to speak of between Rudy and the Democrats.

If we do not find a moderate that can bridge the gap,

Ford and GHWB were moderates, look how that worked out.

[KATIE-O]

Huh??? I don't recollect reading anywhere about any such vow. He bad-mouthed abortion before insisting he would do nothing to stop it. Is that the vow you mean? And I don't think he has ever once said he favors judges who will overturn Roe v. Wade. Instead, he has several times mentioned that he likes the same judges conservatives favor. Wow!




I don't know which program I was watching, (probably Fox News because that's about the only news program I trust) and Rudy Giuliani was talking about the kind of judges he would nominate. He was asked if he thought Roe could be overturned and he stated it would be up to the Supreme Court if the issue was brought before the bench. He also stated pretty much the same thing as Chief Justice Roberts, that Roe was pretty much settled law and not likely to be overturned.....but it could be a state by state issue. I am very much pro-life and would like to see an end to all abortion but I'm also a realist and am not going to hold my breath. I can't really see this nation ever "going back."

[beansox]

"But conservatism--Reagan conservatism--wins every time it's tried except in those poskets of the country that will be blue no matter what."

I hope you are right. I hope you are right for all of our sake, because if the dems control the WH, the Senate, and the House...I maye just have to jump out that plane.

[KATIE-O]

Is it still ok to call Lincoln Chafee a liberal? How about Arlen Specter? Olympia Snowe?

Were you aware that when you look up RINO (Republican in Name only) in wikipedia, it shows Rudy's picture?



Lincoln Chafee voted with the Dems as much or more than he voted with the Republicans. He's definitely a Rino. So is Arlen Specter and John McCain. Olympia Snow is a moderate Republican, but not a Rino, IMO. I could be wrong. I don't think Rudy is a RINO, I think he's a Moderate Republican because he's very conservative on a lot of issues that are important to Republicans. (Oh, I forgot about the King of the Rino's, UpChuck Hagel.)

[KATIE-O]

I posted #228. It strikes me that while the "true conservatives" are not at all smitten with RG, they're pretty much accusing those of us who would consider him as a valid candidate to be socialists. If he somehow manages to get the nom and they make good on their threats to stay home on election day, they'd likely help him win. His appeal to swing voters is solid right now, and will stay the same or increase as he campaigns in a national election.



Funny, but I always considered myself to be a "true conservative." I still do, and I am supporting Rudy Giuliani, along with Ted Olson and David Vitter, and a whole slug of "true conservatives." I guess it has a lot to do with really knowing we HAVE to win this election if we are going to try to win the war against Islamofascism. Losing is not an option.

[KATIE-O]

Are we so desperate for power that we allow ourselves to be blinded by the media, and by those who would have us put our values aside?
Apparently some are, yes. Either that, or they want to advance liberalism.
I suspect it is a combination of both at FR.



I've always said I will support whomever wins the Republican nomination. 100% Support. I would never consider not voting, or leaving the Presidency blank just because I didn't like the candidate.

[dforest]

You must realize that may conservatives feel as you. We are not going to back down.

While Bush is a nice man, he has not been conservative on many issues. He has failed at being a conservative leader.

Many of the conservatives that lost, lost, because of Bush. In their efforts to try and back Bush, they had to depart from their core beliefs. This is why so many of them, the ones that are left, are now trying to separate themselves from him. They had to sacrifice support of their voters in order to back Bush. Do not get excited about Rudy, he is part of the problem and he is not the cure.

While many of us support Bush in the WOT, and his tax issues, we are aware that he was a poor custodian of conservative principals. There is no compromise with libs, as you can see, there is only acquiescence.

[KATIE-O]

The people on this forum who start foaming at the mouth at the mention of Rudy are simply the right wing version of Ralph Nader supporters. They'd be happy to sink a tax cutting, tough on crime, tough on his enemies (foreign and domestic), anti-socialized medicine, pro-school choice Republican over guns, gays and abortion.



Seems so. In the dangerous times we are living in, we have to have "the total package" instead of just someone who will please the ultra Righties in our party. I would prefer that Rudy be with me on Abortion but I'm not concerned with his view that Gays should have equal rights under the law in the form of civil unions. I do to. And I'm not concerned he would "take aways our guns." That's not going to happen. Most people in this country think more along the lines of Rudy than the far right in our party. The young Republicans who are coming of voting age are also more in line with Mr. Giuliani on matters like equal rights for Gays. It's a touchy issue, but shouldn't be.