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Giuliani Seen as More Likeable Candidate in U.S.
Angus Reid Global Monitor ^ | March 18, 2007 | Angus Reid Global Monitor

Posted on 03/17/2007 6:58:02 PM PDT by FairOpinion

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To: M. Thatcher

My best friend at another obscure and far smaller forum, (we've been political and spiritual buddies for 6 years now).....is ProRudy too.....and we've just reached a place where we have stopped trying to convert each other....LOL

All right....out of respect for other views I will try to put myself around my inherent biases and do some research into the mysteries of Rudy.


281 posted on 03/18/2007 11:02:10 AM PDT by Halgr (Once a Marine, always a Marine - Semper Fi)
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To: Mojave
Falsely implying Reagan drove spending

I did no such thing. Much of my professional work is dedicated to championing Reagan's legacy. I really do give up - you are falsely accusing me of things in order to deliberately miss my point, and life is too short.

282 posted on 03/18/2007 11:02:58 AM PDT by M. Thatcher
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To: Mogollon

There has got to be a better conservative out there.

Pray Thompson runs, he's the best out there... Period!


283 posted on 03/18/2007 11:04:51 AM PDT by Confed
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To: M. Thatcher
Much of my professional work is dedicated to championing Reagan's legacy.

Cognitive dissonance.

"Demeaning" is calling names like, oh, I don't know, "leftist scumbag."

The Giuliani campaign should emphasize its candidate's independence from traditional national Republican policies. Especially useful in this strategy is Giuliani's role in overturning a Reagan administration attempt to throw disabled people off the Social Security rolls, his prosecution of Republican elected officials -- especially his authorization for calling his boss, Attorney General Edwin Meese III, a sleaze, and his un-Republican views on many social issues of concern to New Yorkers, like abortion, gun control and bias protection for homosexuals.' - From the 'Guiliani Vulnerability Study - April 1993

284 posted on 03/18/2007 11:07:10 AM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave
Much of my professional work is dedicated to championing Reagan's legacy. Cognitive dissonance.

That's one way to frame it. Another is that I know what I'm talking about, and I'm right about Giuliani. But that is something you will only understand eventually, and I'm not going to spend any more time trying to persuade you now, since facts don't affect your prejudice.

285 posted on 03/18/2007 11:53:45 AM PDT by M. Thatcher
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To: M. Thatcher
Another is that I know what I'm talking about, and I'm right about Giuliani.

And the evidence be damned.

286 posted on 03/18/2007 12:08:14 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave
And the evidence be damned.

That's YOUR philosophy, such as it is. I lived through the real evidence, have seen it with my own eyes.

You'll see it, too, during Giuliani's coming two terms as President of the United States.

You are going to love him.

287 posted on 03/18/2007 12:11:23 PM PDT by M. Thatcher
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To: M. Thatcher
That's YOUR philosophy, such as it is.

Projection.

You'll see it, too, during Giuliani's coming two terms as President of the United States.

Delusion.

You are going to love him.

Only if I experience early senility.

288 posted on 03/18/2007 12:14:35 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave
You are going to love him. Only if I experience early senility.

Want to put money on it?

I am thinking of posting a "future apology to Rudy supporters" thread, as I am absolutely confident that a huge percentage of the anti-Rudy crowd here will ultimately come to love President Guiliani.

I have NO doubt that this will in fact happen. Of course we Rudy-bots will have to experience two years of vile insults in the meantime.

289 posted on 03/18/2007 12:20:21 PM PDT by M. Thatcher
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To: Halgr
All right....out of respect for other views I will try to put myself around my inherent biases and do some research into the mysteries of Rudy.

That is quite decent of you! Ultimately, you may not be convinced, and that is fine - I have enjoyed the debate - but I appreciate you at least being open to think about some of the things I've said. Thanks.

290 posted on 03/18/2007 12:22:23 PM PDT by M. Thatcher
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To: M. Thatcher
I am thinking of posting a "future apology to Rudy supporters" thread, as I am absolutely confident that a huge percentage of the anti-Rudy crowd here will ultimately come to love President Guiliani.

Walter Mitty lives.

291 posted on 03/18/2007 12:22:55 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave

The problem is we're both arguing theories, and I'm willing to concede that but perhaps you aren't.

We have a single fact - abortions in NYC decreased by a more significant percentage than nationally during Rudy Giuliani's term as mayor.

The theories are did Rudy do anything that contributed to that or did it somehow miraculously happen without him doing anything.

Considering the large drop in crime and general "cleaning up" of the city, I'd say his policies played a fairly good-sized role. Perhaps they didn't directly refer to abortion, but an improvement in vice crime, druggies, etc., etc., will most likely also lead to decreased abortion.

Whatever - the FACT is that abortions decreased more under Rudy than elsewhere.

Now it's your turn to provide a source that PROVES beyond a reasonable doubt that it would have happened even if Dinkins were still mayor.


292 posted on 03/18/2007 12:35:55 PM PDT by Spyder
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To: Spyder
We have a single fact - abortions in NYC decreased by a more significant percentage than nationally during Rudy Giuliani's term as mayor.

Still waiting for the cite on that one.

293 posted on 03/18/2007 12:37:42 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave
Sigh. The same dang article you cited (good enough for you but not for me to use???)! Read before you post. First paragraph. Forgive me, but I have a life and I don't care to waste it jousting with fools. The first paragraph:

Murdock -- who is a strong supporter of Giuliani for president in 2008 (as am I) -- does not run from Giuliani's past statements in favor of the pro-choice position. But he points out that during Giuliani's tenure as mayor, the number of abortions fell in New York City by more than the national average, and Giuliani did not actively promote policies that would have led to an increase in the number of abortions.

294 posted on 03/18/2007 12:42:52 PM PDT by Spyder
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To: Mojave; Spyder; NYer
Mojave: "We have a single fact - abortions in NYC decreased by a more significant percentage than nationally during Rudy Giuliani's term as mayor."

NARAL and Planned Parenthood would be VERY surprised to hear that their boy Rudy decreased the number of NYC abortions.

Rudy is not just "pro-abortion." Rudy is joined at the hip to the most radical pro-abortion elements---NARAL, Planned Parenthood, and the rest of the abortion-on-demand-with-the-govt-picking-up-the-tab crowd.

A LOOK AT RUDY'S RADICAL PRO-ABORT PAST IS A GLIMPSE INTO THE FUTURE

Giuliani used his Mayoral term to advance abortion even though as Mayor he had no official mandate nor did he have a legislative role to do so.

From the FEC database: 04/24/1999 Donations
New York State NARAL, Inc Women's Health PAC

NARAL donated exclusively to Democrat candidates with one exception----Rudy Giuliani. Giuliani accepted $1,000 from NARAL in 1999. NARAL gave $250 to Hillary Rodham Clinton. NARAL gave $1000---4 times as much-----to pro-abortion Giuliani.

Clearly, NARAL trusted Rudy's pro-abortion credentials, and Rudy's willingness to advance NARAL's radical abortion-on-demand agenda. NARAL Honored Mayor Rudy for his efforts---he was the honored guest speaker and made The Opening Remarks at NARAL's "Champions of Choice" Luncheon.

Giuliani's 1994 and 1998 tax returns show $500 in donations to Planned Parenthood, the country's largest abortion provider. In 1996, Mayor Giuliani issued a proclamation declaring "Planned Parenthood Day" in New York City, while praising the group's eugenicist founder, Margaret Sanger.

In a CNN interview, Giuliani indicated he does not support even a modest ban on the gruesome partial-birth abortion procedure saying, "No, I have not supported that, and I don't see my position on that changing." Giuliani also indicated he would have upheld President Clinton's veto of the partial-birth abortion ban.

Mayor Rudy told Phil Donahue he'd give his daughter the money for an abortion (to get rid of his own grandchild).

Rudy Giuliani quote, 11/3/89: "There must be public funding for abortion for poor women. We can not deny any woman the right to make her own decision about abortion because she lacks resources. I have also stated that I disagree with President Bush's veto last week of public funding for abortion. "

--------------------------------------------------------

The pro-abort savages have commenced the killing of the innocents----who knows where it will end, with a radical pro-abort type like Rudy handling the levers of government, and NARAL whispering in his ear?

295 posted on 03/18/2007 12:52:17 PM PDT by Liz (Hunter: For some candidates, a conservative constituency is an inconvenience. For me, it is my hope.)
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To: narses

"Why?"

Because.


296 posted on 03/18/2007 1:01:12 PM PDT by Gop1040
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To: Gop1040
Indeed.


297 posted on 03/18/2007 1:05:46 PM PDT by narses ("Freedom is about authority." - Rudolph Giuliani)
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To: Spyder
Sigh. The same dang article you cited

That was a refutation of a sourceless assertion by another Rudy-bot.

C'mon, don't simply invent your "facts".

298 posted on 03/18/2007 1:06:59 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Liz
radical pro-abort type like Rudy handling the levers of government, and NARAL whispering in his ear?

Please explain to me why abortions decreased in NYC by more than the national trend during Rudy's term if he's so PRO-abortion.

He believes a woman should be allowed to hold her own beliefs as to whether or not human life begins at conception (the bible is a bit hazy on that one) and to make her own decision, preferably not to abort. That is a policy that follows the law as it is currently written. You and the Terri-bots have the majority of Americans scared to death of a nutcase in office who bears more of a resemblance to Randall Terry than to Ronald Reagan.

299 posted on 03/18/2007 1:07:44 PM PDT by Spyder
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To: dc-zoo

I don't think Rudy is loved in Arab countries. ;)


300 posted on 03/18/2007 1:09:01 PM PDT by veronica ('My 80% ally is not my 20% enemy.' ........Rudy reminds us what Ronald Reagan said.)
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