Running the Republican Numbers on Rudy (50% won't support liberal, 57% don't know Rudy is)

Fox News ^ | 18 February 2007 | Tom Bevan

[Spiff]

Running the Republican Numbers on Rudy

Trying to read too much into any 2008 poll at this point, especially with respect to horserace numbers, is somewhat silly and a waste of time. But a recent FOX News poll does have some interesting tidbits in the internals asking about voters' general impressions on issues.

[snip]

Are you more who are more or less likely to support a candidate who is pro-choice on the issue of abortion? Republicans only: More likely 22 percent (a lot more likely 12 percent, somewhat more likely 10 percent). Less likely 46 percent (a lot less likely 36 percent, somewhat less likely 10 percent). Not a major factor 30 percent.

Are you more who are more or less likely to support a candidate who supports civil unions for gays and lesbians? Republicans only: More likely 8 percent (a lot more likely 5 percent, somewhat more likely 3 percent). Less likely 50 percent (a lot less likely 39 percent, somewhat less likely 11 percent). Not a major factor 38 percent.

[snip]

The biggest red flag for Giuliani has to be that only 42 percent of Republicans surveyed correctly identified him as pro-choice. Twenty-one percent of Republican voters have it wrong and think Giuliani is pro-life, and another 36 percent of Republicans don't have a clue what his position on abortion. In other words, nearly six out of 10 registered Republican voters have yet to learn something about Giuliani which, we can infer from the first question on abortion, will make close to half of them either "somewhat" less likely or "a lot" less likely to vote for him. There's no doubt the same holds true of his position on civil unions for gays, and the Second Amendment as well.

[Sun]

"We've got a lot of work to do to educate them."

We need to write letters to editors, and call talk shows, and let conservatives know that Rudy stands for this:

Rudy is against the 2nd amendment, is pro-abortion, including pba, pro-illegal immigration, pro-special rights for gays, and even believes in MAN-MADE global warming? He is a lib!

[Spiff]

However, I am dismayed that he stated opposition to the PBA in the Senate.

He didn't just state his opposition to the partial birth abortion ban, he told George Will in 2000 that his support of partial birth abortion itself was as "firm" as the rest of his positions. He accepted a "champion of choice" award from NARAL. He celebrated the 25th anniversary of Roe v. Wade with the NARAL ghouls. He has even stated that he'd pay to have his own grandchild aborted. That's not a moderate "pro-choice" position. That's leftist fringe radical pro-abortion stuff right there.

[jwalsh07]

First off, Reagan, like Giuliani, supported abortion as the "law of the land," when he represented California.

Not a valid comparison. Rudy, unlike RR, was a nomially pro life Catholic who renounced that position and embraced abortion on demand to get elected as Mayor in New York City.

Whereas RR came to believe that his signature was a mistake Rudy has come to believe in unfettered abortion with the additional bonus of having taxpayers pay for it.

[WhistlingPastTheGraveyard]

So those 57% of Republicans who don't know anything about the man's positions are fully engaged in a vigorous debate?

What exactly have they been debating? Certainly not candidates and where they stand on anything.

[LtdGovt]

Partial-birth abortion is a non-issue, since Congress passed a law and President Bush signed it. And Rudy supports that law. That makes the issue moot.

[LtdGovt]

It's not either-or, I want to know what Spiff's priorities are. Is hating pro-choicers a higher priority for him, than defeating the Islamic menace?

[LtdGovt]

How could anyone vote for a U.S. president who not only would tolerate such a holocaust, but who has spent his entire elected political career SUPPORTING IT?

It's ridiculous to refer to it as a 'holocaust', especially if you are aware of the etymological roots of the wors. Supporting a man who would defeat terrorists is a no-brainer for me. The War on Terror is the most important issue. We must defeat the terrorists and the religion of Islam, crush them, destroy them, eradicate them!

By time the next president is inaugurated you can add another 2.5 million human lives ended by abortionists in the United States.

Who is worse, a terrorist or an abortionist?

[Spiff]

Supporting a man who would defeat terrorists is a no-brainer for me. The War on Terror is the most important issue. We must defeat the terrorists and the religion of Islam, crush them, destroy them, eradicate them!

Almost every Republican in the race right now would fight the WoT with every bit as much conviction as Giuliani. Most do not possess the same awful character flaws and baggage as Giuliani. Again, you're offering another false choice. You're saying that we either pick a pro-abortionist or someone who won't fight the War on Terror. There's at least a handful of Republican candidates right now who will do BOTH. They need their chance and Giuliani's travelling deception show isn't going to allow that. Giuliani's atrocious views must be exposed to the Republicans who are unaware of them so that they may make an educated choice in the primary election.

[M. Thatcher]

Oh, I see you are one of those "once people know Rudy's horrible positions, they'll all reject him like I do!" people.

I don't expect those arguments to get any more traction than they already have.

[Spiff]

It's ridiculous to refer to it as a 'holocaust', especially if you are aware of the etymological roots of the word.

The Shoa was not the only holocaust. The word refers to any massive loss of human life.

[Reagan Man]

>>>>First off, Reagan, like Giuliani, supported abortion as the "law of the land," when he represented California.

When Reagan signed the 1967 Therapeutic Abortion Act, he said he did it out of sympathy for the victims of rape, incest and for those women who may be facing health risks or worse, death from childbirth. Reagan did not sign it out of political expediency. There was no flip flop in it. This was one of the first actions taken in the modern abortion battle. An action Reagan regretted within a year and a decision that haunted him for the remainder of his life.

The three exceptions rule is not the same as abortion on demand. Rudy Giuliani has made countless public statements over his entire public career supporting a womans right to choose death, and to kill her unborn child using abortion as a birth control measure..... 95% of the time! Give me a break. Reagan's position on abortion was the complete opposite of what Rudy`s abortion stance is today.

Reagan held a conservative position that life was precious and the unborn should be protected and defended in life by the elected servants of the people. Rudy`s position is far leftwing extremism. On the abortion issue Rudy agrees with the Clinton's, Algore, Barack Obama, Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, John Edwards and most of the Democratic Party. On the abortion issue Rudy disagrees with Ronald Reagan, GW Bush and the millions of prolife Americans. Many of them who are FReepers. You don't make Rudy`s candidacy look better by taking cheap pot shots at the Reagan legacy. Rudy remains a liberal. Rudy is NO conservative. Rudy has little in common with Reagan. And Rudy has absolutely nothing in common with Reagan on the abortion issue. PERIOD! Understood?

[LtdGovt]

Almost every Republican in the race right now would fight the WoT with every bit as much conviction as Giuliani.

And I will vote for them. I will even vote for your candidate, if he wins, despite his dubious record on fiscal issues and free trade.

There's at least a handful of Republican candidates right now who will do BOTH.

Unfortunately, they would not make strong general election candidates. Rudy will. He will destroy Hillary. You should realize that strong convictions on the WOT are of little use if the candidate does not get elected.

Giuliani's atrocious views must be exposed to the Republicans who are unaware of them so that they may make an educated choice in the primary election.

Don't worry, they will. But I don't know whether true conservatives will care. And I'm confident that the GOP will choose a decent candidate, like Rudy, Romney or Sanford.

[LtdGovt]

The Shoa was not the only holocaust. The word refers to any massive loss of human life.

No, I was not referring to the Shoah, but to the Greek roots of the word. There is a reason why the Shoah is called the Holocaust.

And I wouldn't put a fertilized egg on par with a 30-year old Jew. That's insulting.

[LtdGovt]

An action Reagan regretted within a year and a decision that haunted him for the remainder of his life.

Please provide the evidence for your claim that he regretted the decision. It seems sound to me, women who have been raped are the last people you want to punish by forcing them to give birth to a rapists' child.

[Reagan Man]

>>>>>Who is worse, a terrorist or an abortionist?

How many American deaths has there been from terrorism in modern times?

How many American deaths has there been from the abortion procedure in modern times?

[WhistlingPastTheGraveyard]

It's ridiculous to refer to it as a 'holocaust', especially if you are aware of the etymological roots of the wors.

One of the modern definitions of the word refers to "any mass slaughter or reckless destruction of life".

How does the etymological derivative of the word disqualify the above definition from describing the act of killing nearly 50 million children? Seems like a perfect fit to me.

[fightu4it]

Are you willing to prostitute your values a little, or a lot in order to keep a democrat out of the White House?

I support selecting a republican candidate at the national convention who I can vote for without prostituting my core values.

[LtdGovt]

Just answer the question, will you? Are you going to say that an abortionist is worse than Osama bin Laden?

[WhistlingPastTheGraveyard]

Wow, you were able to label me and put irrational words in my mouth all in one sentence. Pretty good.

See you in Minnesota.

[Doc Savage]

Try running the numbers on the DumboRats for a change. Last time I looked we were out of poer and picking on our own is pathetic!