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s it not obvious to you that a child born with cystic fibrosis was designed badly.

The only thing that is really obvious to me, is that you think it is a design problem.

Look, I think you raise some interesting points here, but in raisng those points, it does not necessarily prompt me to raise my fist in the air and shake it at God.

I don't know why God allows human suffering. All I can do is speculate from my limited vantage point, and hope that these things bring me closer to God, rather than further away...

s it not obvious to you that a child born with cystic fibrosis was designed badly.

The only thing that is really obvious to me, is that you think it is a design problem.

You might want to talk with the parents of a child with CF to see if they also think it is a design problem. Also, ask the child with CF too. Then ask a doctor how a single mutation in sodium transport leads to the conditions called CF. Once you understand the cause of the disease, you will see that it is a just a simple design problem.

Then you need to go back to my definition of "good" and "bad" design. Several times I have been asked on this thread how one can possibly ever know what the motives of the creator are. And several times I have stated that I don't need to know the motives to determine whether or not the design is "good". For example, if the intent of the creator is to cause suffering, there are other errors that are far worse than CF. For example, some babies are born without deformed faces, such as Treacher Collins Syndrome. This syndrome causes more suffering than CF for the afflicted because TCS kids live longer than CF kids. If the intent is to make children suffer, then CF is not the most effective way to do so.

I don't need to know what the intent of the designer of the vehicle called the "Le Car" is to know it is a poor car. One can easily access its capabilities. It has a horrible service record due to poor design. You might argue that the car was intentionally created to break down to cause human suffering. I would argue that if the car maker intended to cause suffering, that it might have made the seats burst into flames causing burns to the driver and the passenger, which would cause more suffering than the Le Car does when it is just sitting in one's driveway not working.

Look, I think you raise some interesting points here, but in raisng those points, it does not necessarily prompt me to raise my fist in the air and shake it at God.

Where in the world did that point come from. Nobody wants you to raise your fist in the air and shake it at anyone.

This goes back to the original post about using one's brain versus using one's gut. There is absolutely no reason to get emotional here and to shake your fist at anything. Simply look at the design of humans and note that they are not designed very well. That's it. Save your fist shaking for another time.

I don't know why God allows human suffering. All I can do is speculate from my limited vantage point, and hope that these things bring me closer to God, rather than further away...

I don't know why either. I do know that if his intent is to cause suffering, he's not doing a very good job of that either. He could cause far more suffering if he were more like the Old Testament God smiting entire peoples. My only point is that if one is intent on using the term "Intelligent Design" then one needs to come to grips with the FACT that the design is not very good. It is better than NO design, but it is not so great either.

jas3

It is not at all clear to me that a life without death and suffering would be fulfilling for us humans. If you think we are self-absorbed NOW, just imagine the elimination of the possibility of loss and sorrow from our lives! We'd soon become an uncaring and miserable lot, yearning for a way to escape.
As for those persuaded by the absurd TOE(volution), if you think that redundancy must be indicative of a sloppy or mediocre "designer" god at best, I say that all of you brilliant scientists should join forces. I mean, you can eliminate all the "junk" you have discerned, and start with all the simple elements of life we know and create that perfect "simple" cell. I know you guys can do it! Bob