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The Libertarian Effect
Real Clear Politics ^ | 11/13/06 | ROSS KAMINSKY

Posted on 11/14/2006 6:25:58 PM PST by Purple GOPer

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To: Purple GOPer
A lot of utter nonsense in here.

A "libertarian", in the shortest definition I can muster, is someone who is fiscally conservative and socially liberal.

Uh, no. That's false. I'm a libertarian and I will never, ever accept the label "socially liberal."

In other words, it is someone who wants the government to perform a very small set of legitimate functions and otherwise leave us alone.

Better, but that's not the same thing at all.

No, the Democrats are not that government. They believe in anything but limited government, and they only believe in liberty in one's personal life, but not in one's economic life.

Again, simply untrue. The Democrats do NOT believe in personal liberty. If they did, they'd hold conservative positions on firearms, tobacco, seat-belt laws, etc. They don't because they are totalitarian on both 'social' and 'economic' issues -- which is a false dichotomy anyway.

221 posted on 11/15/2006 6:58:22 AM PST by Sloth (The GOP is to DemonRats in politics as Michael Jackson is to Jeffrey Dahmer in babysitting.)
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To: Dead Corpse

Ask JimRob.

But, again, look how you've changed the subject after you have been shown to be pig ignorant about your own "principals."

Anybody can go through you posting history and see what you do on this site.

It's called trolling. You are doing it on the Rudy Giuliani threads. (Where, ironically, you are excoriating him for being pro-abortion.)

You do it everywhere.

Soros/Moby must be proud.


222 posted on 11/15/2006 7:00:59 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Sam Hill
But, again, look how you've changed the subject after you have been shown to be pig ignorant about your own "principals."

Actually, I've stated my position and corrected your mis-representation of the LP party plank. You refuse to admit your "error". Which means, you are an outright liar.

And no, it's called "posting". Further, if I were a Soros/Moby plant as you assert, I'd be pushing LIBERAL positions instead of conservative positions. I'd be rooting FOR your liberal RINO's instead of pointing out how LIBERAL they are.

So yeah, between the two of us... you are the more likely "plant".

You can't argue, you ignore facts, and your logic sucks. Are you still in high school by any chance?

223 posted on 11/15/2006 7:05:03 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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To: Dead Corpse

Your references to the Constitution are risible.

Name one thing that the current administration did that was un-Constitutional?

You won't, because you can't.

You read comic books and quote Jefferson (who would have hanged most libertarians) and think you are intellectual.

It's sad, really. But also laugh out loud hilarious.


224 posted on 11/15/2006 7:05:49 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Sam Hill

REPUBLICAN LIBERTY CAUCUS POSITION STATEMENT
posted by Jim Robinson
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-rlc/721810/posts


225 posted on 11/15/2006 7:07:07 AM PST by tpaine
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To: Sam Hill
The libertarians (l and L) position on abortion is that government should never interfere.

As a libertarian, I disagree. In fact, I am mostly a 'one-issue' voter on the topic of abortion. I simply will not vote for a pro-abortion candidate (Giuliani, Rice) or a candidate who seems to have adopted an anti-abortion stance only for political convenience (McCain, Romney).

But that doesn't change the fact that constitutionally, the issue belongs at the state level, not federal.

226 posted on 11/15/2006 7:08:40 AM PST by Sloth (The GOP is to DemonRats in politics as Michael Jackson is to Jeffrey Dahmer in babysitting.)
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To: Dead Corpse

"Actually, I've stated my position and corrected your mis-representation of the LP party plank."

You are a liar. The Libertarian party platform says NOTHING about abortion being decided on the state level or by a Constitutional amendment:

Official Website of the Libertarian National Committee

I.8 Reproductive Rights

The Issue: The tragedies caused by unplanned, unwanted pregnancies are aggravated and sometimes created by government policies of censorship, restriction, regulation and prohibition.

Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on both sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration.

The Principle: Individual rights should not be denied nor abridged on the basis of sex, age, dependency, or location. Taxpayers should not be forced to pay for other people's abortions, nor should any government or individual force a woman to have an abortion. It is the right and obligation of the pregnant woman regardless of age, not the state, to decide the desirability or appropriateness of prenatal testing, Caesarean births, fetal surgery, voluntary surrogacy arrangements and/or home births.

Solutions: We oppose government actions that either compel or prohibit abortion, sterilization or any other form of birth control. Specifically we condemn the practice of forced sterilization of welfare recipients, or of mentally retarded or "genetically defective" individual. We support the voluntary exchange of goods, services or information regarding human sexuality, reproduction, birth control or related medical or biological technologies. We oppose government laws and policies that restrict the opportunity to choose alternatives to abortion.

Transitional Action: We support an end to all subsidies for childbearing or child prevention built into our present laws.

http://www.lp.org/issues/platform_all.shtml#reprodright


227 posted on 11/15/2006 7:09:13 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Sam Hill
Name one thing that the current administration did that was un-Constitutional?

I can answer that. There are several things, but the most egregious was Bush signing the Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act of 2002.

228 posted on 11/15/2006 7:10:59 AM PST by Sloth (The GOP is to DemonRats in politics as Michael Jackson is to Jeffrey Dahmer in babysitting.)
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To: Dead Corpse

What a party of principals. One could easily substitute this:

"Recognizing that [sex with underaged boys] is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on both sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration."


229 posted on 11/15/2006 7:11:31 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Sam Hill
Name one thing that the current administration did that was un-Constitutional?

Changing the topic again? Fine. Signing McCain-Feingold. Prescription Drug give-away. Not securing the Borders and purposing an Amnesty (it wasn't right when Reagan did it, it's even less right now). There's more by why bother?

As for my reading habits, my tastes are wide and varied, from Aristotle to Zelman. Yours apparently, are limited to "See Jane run..."

Is this all you have left? Insults? Figures.

230 posted on 11/15/2006 7:12:19 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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To: Sam Hill
Official Website of the Libertarian National Committee

Using that as the basis to figure out what libertarians are about is like reading the Republican Party platform to figure out what a republic is.

231 posted on 11/15/2006 7:14:46 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: Sam Hill
Er... no. Again you show your towering ignorance. Children cannot give consent to such acts. Nor can animals. Their Rights are held in trust by their parents/guardian until they reach the age of majority/maturity and can then exercise them on their own.

But, if you had even so much as a minuscule clue about what you were talking about, you would have known that.

Nice going troll... Showing your ignorance like this with these utterly moronic strawmen is just too easy.

232 posted on 11/15/2006 7:15:23 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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To: Sloth

I tend to agree with you on that one. But technically, the Supreme Court has upheld it.

Supposedly to Bush's surprise and disappointment.


233 posted on 11/15/2006 7:16:07 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Dead Corpse

"Prescription Drug give-away. Not securing the Borders and purposing an Amnesty (it wasn't right when Reagan did it, it's even less right now). There's more by why bother?"

Maybe you should go back and re-read the Constitution.

Anyway, I've wasted more than enough time on you. You are obdurate in your stupidity.

Enjoy your comic books and the next forty years (at least) of Democrat rule.


234 posted on 11/15/2006 7:17:31 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: jjm2111
Good for the libertarians like me. (Though I hate abortion. It's a life, not a "choice")

Same here. There's an organization named Libertarians for Life that believes in the following principles:

1. Human offspring are human beings, persons from fertilization.
2. Abortion is homicide -- the killing of one person by another.
3. There is never a right to kill an innocent person. Prenatally, we are all innocent persons.
4. A prenatal child has the right to be in the mother's body. Parents have no right to evict their children from the crib or from the womb and let them die. Instead both parents, the father as well as the mother, owe them support and protection from harm.
5. No government, nor any individual, has a just power to legally depersonify any one of us, born or preborn. 6. The proper purpose of the law is to side with the innocent, not against them.

235 posted on 11/15/2006 7:19:07 AM PST by rochester_veteran (born and raised in rachacha!)
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To: tacticalogic

You too are a perfect example of what I've been saying.

I posted what the LP position on abortion is. The previous poster said I was wrong and "corrected me."

When I then post the exact words, you say that it is wrong to use that as a basis.

No wonder you people never get anything done. Words have no meaning to you. Nothing does but your bongs.


236 posted on 11/15/2006 7:19:20 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Dead Corpse

"Children cannot give consent to such acts. Nor can animals."

But fetuses can?

LOL!!!!!

Again, you can't argue with stupidity. You've proved that.


237 posted on 11/15/2006 7:21:37 AM PST by Sam Hill
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To: Sam Hill

You can save the insults. I'm not contributing to your little flame war.


238 posted on 11/15/2006 7:22:05 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: Sam Hill
Maybe you should go back and re-read the Constitution.

Still waiting on you to show me where in the Constitution you find authority for the FedGov to "regulate" the abortion/medical care industry. You know there is nothing there, but admitting this would make you seem like the trolling like fool you are.

Run along now... try not to pee on the floor on your way out the door.

239 posted on 11/15/2006 7:22:09 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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To: Sam Hill
But fetuses can?

Have you been drinking?

240 posted on 11/15/2006 7:23:06 AM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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